Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please confirm:-
1) how much was or will be paid by the council for the Grange shopping centre, and separately how much was paid by the council for the pyramids shopping centre, Milton pavement, and the Vue cinema, and the old Beatties store and the shopping centre block that includes Wilko and Mecca bingo.
2) from where and how were the funds obtained for each of these purchases.
3) does / will the council own these shopping centres without ownership or other rights being shared with other entities (if no please provide details)
4) for the old John laird wetherspoons pub property did the council become owners before or after wetherspoons left? How much rent or other income have the council received from that property since? How much rent and business rates and other income could the council have reasonably expected to have received if the property had not been left empty since council ownership began and to date? Lost income aside, how much has this unit cost the council to keep empty over this period?
5) how much is the offices currently being built on the old Milton pavement site likely to cost the council to complete? Who will own and be entitled to receive rent and other income from this site? If anyone other than the council has any potential and or part/full claim or right to control, run or receive rent or other income here please confirm full details of those arrangements.
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Good Morning
Thank you for your request. Unfortunatley there was no FOI Request
included. If you could email back with your FOI Request and we can send it
onto the service area for an answer
Many thanks
Emma Louise Murphy
FOI/EIR ENQUIRY - Please see request for recorded information
below/attached, which we believe falls within the responsibility of your
Department. The Council has a 20 working day timeframe to either respond
in full or refuse the request.
[1]https://ico.org.uk/about-the-ico/news-an...
FOI: If you believe this enquiry will take over 18.5 hours to fulfil,
please contact as soon as possible with brief details so we can contact
the enquirer.
EIR exemptions EIR regs
[2]http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2004/...
If you do not hold the recorded information in question, please advise.
PLEASE FORWARD ALL FOI RESPONSES TO [3][Wirral Borough Council request email]
Type of feedback* = Not Applicable
Name (title, first name and surname or business name) = John Jones
Contact address (if different from contact centre address) =
Customer's contact number (full number no spaces) =
Customer's email address = [4][FOI #982018 email]
Other contact details (if applicable eg name, address, tel no.) =
Type of request* = Freedom of Information
Enter division = Business Services (BS)
Enter sub-division = BS Finance (FIN)
Enter service = FIN Finance
Nature of contact* = SEE NOTES
Any other information =
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2. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2004/...
3. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
4. mailto:[FOI #982018 email]
Dear Murphy, Emma,
I am confused by your reply.
My request clearly asks for several pieces of information.
Please clarify exactly why you believe no FOI Request was included.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Good Afternoon John Jones
Your request has come through as below:
Type of feedback* = Not Applicable
Name (title, first name and surname or business name) = John Jones
Contact address (if different from contact centre address) =
Customer's contact number (full number no spaces) =
Customer's email address = [FOI #982018 email]
Other contact details (if applicable eg name, address, tel no.) =
Type of request* = Freedom of Information
Enter division = Business Services (BS)
Enter sub-division = BS Finance (FIN)
Enter service = FIN Finance
Nature of contact* = SEE NOTES
Any other information =
There doesn’t seem to be any more information available to us, I think it may be the system not including the SEE NOTES part possibly.
As you had taken the time to send us your request I thought it would be helpful to ask you for the information we couldn’t see so I can process your FOI.
Is that okay?
Many Thanks
Emma
Information Management Officer
PLEASE FORWARD ALL FOI RESPONSES TO [Wirral Borough Council request email]
Dear Murphy, Emma,
Thank you for clarifying.
I cannot see how it appears at your end and do not know why you cannot see it.
Full page link here -
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Text of request here -
Please confirm:-
1) how much was or will be paid by the council for the Grange shopping centre, and separately how much was paid by the council for the pyramids shopping centre, Milton pavement, and the Vue cinema, and the old Beatties store and the shopping centre block that includes Wilko and Mecca bingo.
2) from where and how were the funds obtained for each of these purchases.
3) does / will the council own these shopping centres without ownership or other rights being shared with other entities (if no please provide details)
4) for the old John laird wetherspoons pub property did the council become owners before or after wetherspoons left? How much rent or other income have the council received from that property since? How much rent and business rates and other income could the council have reasonably expected to have received if the property had not been left empty since council ownership began and to date? Lost income aside, how much has this unit cost the council to keep empty over this period?
5) how much is the offices currently being built on the old Milton pavement site likely to cost the council to complete? Who will own and be entitled to receive rent and other income from this site? If anyone other than the council has any potential and or part/full claim or right to control, run or receive rent or other income here please confirm full details of those arrangements.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Many thanks we can now process your FOI
Kind Regards
Emma
Information Management Officer
PLEASE FORWARD ALL FOI RESPONSES TO [Wirral Borough Council request email]
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
The reason for asking for the review is that no response has so far been provided.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Mr Jones
We apologise for the delay in responding to your recent FOI enquiry, which
led to your request for an internal review dated 21 June 2023.
Please see below our response to your original FOI questions, we trust
that this will negate your request for an internal review on the basis of
no response being received.
1) how much was or will be paid by the council for the Grange shopping
centre, and separately how much was paid by the council for the pyramids
shopping centre, Milton pavement, and the Vue cinema, and the old Beatties
store and the shopping centre block that includes Wilko and Mecca bingo.
Old Beatties store - purchased by Council for £2,000,000
Europa Centre - purchased by Council for £8,400,000
Vue - purchased by Council for £6,800,000
Milton Pavement - purchased by Council for £290,000
In respect of the purchase price for the Grange and Pyramids shopping
centres, we consider this to be commercially sensitive and decline to
respond under S43 of the Freedom of Information Act 2000. S43(2) FOIA
states information is exempt where it would, or would be likely to,
prejudice commercial interests of the Council or another person. As this
is a qualified exemption, we have considered whether the public interest
in withholding the information outweighs the public interest in disclosing
the information. In reaching our conclusion we have considered the factors
in favour of and against disclosure.
The Council believes in promoting transparency and accountability for
decisions taken. We recognise that the spending of public money is a
serious concern in the current financial climate and that it is in the
public interest to share information that would allow the public to
understand how money is being spent and what services are being provided.
However, we strongly believe that disclosing this sensitive information
would damage the commercial interests of the vendor, Mars Pension Fund,
having regard to its marketing of other shopping centres within its
ownership. Whilst eventually the price will be recorded on land registry
records, the registration will not be for some time, by which time the
commercial sensitivities referred to above will be historic.
2) from where and how were the funds obtained for each of these purchases.
Acquisitions have been funded from capital programme borrowing. The
capital programme is financed on a block basis so there is no specific
loan against a specific asset. Lease income (where applicable) is used to
cover the cost of borrowing. Milton Pavement has been leased with the
lease premium received covering the cost of acquisition.
3) does / will the council own these shopping centres without ownership or
other rights being shared with other entities (if no please provide
details)
There are number of tenancies within the Grange and Pyramids shopping
centres. It would breach confidentiality to provide detailsand we again
rely upon S43(2) FOIA as detailed above.
4) for the old John laird wetherspoons pub property did the council become
owners before or after wetherspoons left? How much rent or other income
have the council received from that property since? How much rent and
business rates and other income could the council have reasonably expected
to have received if the property had not been left empty since council
ownership began and to date? Lost income aside, how much has this unit
cost the council to keep empty over this period?
• for the old John laird wetherspoons pub property did the council
become owners before or after wetherspoons left? - The John Laird
‘Wetherspoons’ unit was vacant when the Council acquired the site.
This is disclosed in the 27^th November 2017 Cabinet report which can
be found on the Council’s website.
• How much rent or other income have the council received from that
property since? - It has not been let since therefore no income/rent
has been received.
• How much rent and business rates and other income could the council
have reasonably expected to have received if the property had not been
left empty since council ownership began and to date? – Not a valid
FOI request. We cannot speculate on ‘expectations’ and hold no
recorded information in response to this.
• Lost income aside, how much has this unit cost the council to keep
empty over this period? – We do not hold this information in a
centralised location but our Finance team are seeking to provide a
breakdown in respect of that individual building and we will revert
back to you as soon as possible.
5) how much is the offices currently being built on the old Milton
pavement site likely to cost the council to complete? Who will own and be
entitled to receive rent and other income from this site? If anyone other
than the council has any potential and or part/full claim or right to
control, run or receive rent or other income here please confirm full
details of those arrangements
See link to Cabinet report of July 2020. The Council has a 43 year lease
from Canada Life with rent payable for 35 years. The rent has not yet
been established but will be determined once the works are completed, the
buildings will be measured so as to determine the lettable area. The
lettable area will then be multiplied by the agreed rate per square foot
to arrive at the rent payable by the Council. The confidential appendix
retains that status.
[1]https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/ieListDo...
If you are unhappy with the way in which your request has been handled,
you may ask for an internal review by emailing
[2][Wirral Borough Council request email]. If you remain unhappy with the
outcome of the internal review, you have the right to apply directly to
the Information Commissioner for a decision. The Information Commissioner
can be contacted at: [3]https://ico.org.uk/global/contact-us/
Yours sincerely
Lynette Paterson
Principal Information Management Officer
Resources – Digital and Improvement
Wirral Council
PO Box 290
Brighton Street
Wallasey
CH27 9FQ
Email: [4][Wirral Borough Council request email]
Visit our website: [5]www.wirral.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
References
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2. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
3. https://ico.org.uk/global/contact-us/
4. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
5. http://www.wirral.gov.uk/
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
1) Thank you for confirming the prices for the old Beatties store, the Europa Centre, Vue and Milton Pavement.
In relation to the Grange and the Pyramids shopping centres it is not enough simply to state that the commercial interests of the seller in relation to other shopping centres they may wish to sell would be prejudiced by disclosing the requested prices at this stage. The onus is on you to demonstrate prejudice and I do not believe you have done so. It is not clear whether they are seeking to market any other shopping centres and even if they are it is not clear how disclosure of these prices no matter what they would be would be prejudicial to those efforts for other shopping centres in other areas. That is even more so here when Wirral Council as has been publicly stated repeatedly in relation to their recent purchases of real estate at very high values are a highly motivated purchaser seeking to obtain control of large areas of the two centre for the long term benefit of the borough. As such I doubt the prices paid for the Grange and the Pyramids shopping centre are in any way under open market value and are more likely far over it. Please therefore demonstrate the prejudice.
Even if you are able to demonstrate such prejudice it is unclear why the end point at which it would no longer be prejudicial is the unclear and variable time period once the land registry entry is updated. If there was a time period after which you believe it would no longer be prejudicial please confirm that period and demonstrate that it is no longer than it need be. If you are able to demonstrate the prejudice and the prejudice being a particular set length of time please confirm that you will update your response with the prices at the end of that time without delay. Otherwise I and anyone else wishing to learn of those prices would have to pay a fee to obtain the land registry entry and there is no way to confirm whether it has been updated until you have already purchased it so this might involve several purchases and or unnecessary delay in giving it enough time to be more sure an update has occurred.
2) Thank you for providing information on the funds for the purchases. I am a little unclear on the lease structure for Milton Pavement but will leave that request further for the time being.
3) The mere existence of tenancies within the Grange and the Pyramids shopping centres is insufficient to claim the exemption you have for that request for information. Please demonstrate it or provide the information.
4) Thank you for providing some of the information I requested for the old John Laird Unit and confirming you are working on and will provide information regarding the cost of keeping it empty.
I would have thought you do have information already regarding the business rates that are applicable to this unit were it to be rented, please could you confirm why this is not available as I find that confusing.
Beyond that while I understand you are not required to create information you do not have or to speculate on the lost income for this unit, I am very surprised that in considering purchasing the Europa Centre at such a cost that any information on the potential income from that unit appears not to have been recorded in for example due diligence appraisals before the purchase, and anyway even if it had not that the unit would then sit empty for 6 years and ongoing still now without any information then being created anywhere within the council regarding that loss and any efforts to consider avoiding that loss continuing. Are you sure you have not just refused on the basis of believing the request is asking you to speculate rather than searching for information on speculation that may already have occurred within and been recorded by the council? If your position remains that the council holds no information regarding any consideration being given to the income that could be earnt via this asset the council has bought at great expense or any consideration as to what to do about the continuing loss then please confirm.
Additionally if there is any information regarding some other reason as to why the council has never considered this (for example a direct decision being made to keep the unit empty for some reason or perhaps there being some issue with the unit so that it must be kept empty) then please provide that. Here and generally I would remind you of your duty to advise and assist, including in supporting me to reframe my requests so that I might obtain the information I seek.
Please confirm the date the unit became owned by the council.
Please also provide records of any contact with Wetherspoons and or their agents regarding this unit as well as records of any contacts with anyone else about the possibility of renting or making some use of this unit or of marketing it for rent or use of this unit, or internal communications, reports or notes regarding the same.
The cabinet report appears to be linked here
https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/ieListDo...
That refers to
‘The strategic case for the acquisition is set out in the report below however the commercial details of the proposal is contained in the attached technical appendix which is exempt from publication due to commercial sensitivity considerations under Schedule 12A of the Local Government Act 1972.’
As 6 years has passed and the old John Laird Unit within this £8.4million property purchased by the council is still empty now please provide that technical appendix.
5) Thank you for providing some information here. I am a little unclear on the lease structure for Milton Pavement but will leave that request further for the time being.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio' because I await a reply to my most recent message if 13/07/2023 and part of what I await was originally requested before that.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Good Morning John Jones
Please note we have logged your request as an Internal Review on July 13th, it is being processed.
We aim to respond as soon as we can and apologise for the delay in this matter, thank you for your patience.
Kind Regards
Emma Murphy
Information Management Team
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
Aswell as my earlier requests please provide an outline summary of the lease structure for the Milton pavement sites.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of all of my FOI requests within 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
Reason - Still nothing after all this time. Not even an acknowledgement.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
In relation to my already made request for an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio' I have since seen this news report -
https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liv...
Please include comment in your internal review as to whether this report is correct. If it is please confirm how, when and why this information (my request for which was refused) was provided to the press.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
The reason for requesting an internal review is that I have repeatedly requested internal reviews here over quite a period of time now and Wirral Council have failed to do so, or attempted to offer any explanation of their failure to do so, or offer any real reassurance that they will review or provide the information I have requested.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Mr Jones
I write further to your emails of 13 July, 12 August, 25 August, 11
September, 1 October and 27 October 2023, in which you requested an
internal review of the Council’s FOI response dated 11 July 2023. I
apologise for the delay in responding to you.
Your original request, response and all additional correspondence has now
been reviewed and discussed with the relevant departments. In addition to
this, further in-house legal advice has been obtained in relation to your
main point of concern - the application of the exemption at Section 43(2)
FOIA, to financial information that was considered commercially sensitive
and prejudicial to both the Council and its partners if disclosed.
In reaching that decision the public interest test was fully considered
and factors for and against disclosure were provided. Upon review and
consideration of all relevant factors and your comments, it remains the
Council’s position that the exemption was correctly applied and I uphold
the original decision.
On 25 August 2023, you included a new request for “an outline summary of
the lease structure for the Milton pavement sites”.
In response to this additional enquiry, please see the following link to
the Cabinet report of July 2020 which sets out details of the transaction
under Item 13, ‘Lease for New Offices in BCD’ -
[1]https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/document...
We trust this provides the required information.
This concludes our internal review of FOI 1652833 and no further
correspondence will be entered into, in respect of this enquiry. If you
remain dissatisfied then you have the right to complain to the Information
Commissioner’s Office, [2]www.ico.org.uk, contact details for which have
been provided previously.
Yours sincerely
Jane Corrin
ICT Governance and Compliance Manager (DPO)
ICT & Digital
Currently Working From Home – Working Pattern Tuesday to Friday
Visit our website [3]www.wirral,gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
References
Visible links
1. https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/document...
2. http://www.ico.org.uk/
3. http://www.wirral,gov.uk/
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
Reasons -
I cannot understand why you appear to have simply ignored various requests for information of mine and have internal reviewed and responded only on what you have decided for yourself is my ‘main point of concern’ (the application of the section 43(2) FOIA) and that you say you will not enter into any further correspondence.
Section 43(2) was never invoked by you in relation to my various requests for information on the old john laird unit, which remain outstanding. This includes but is not limited to even that request which you previously stated you were going to obtain me the information for but have still not done so (on 11/07/2023 you stated that the finance team were seeking to provide a breakdown in respect of the cost to keep the unit empty and would revert to me as soon as possible. Nothing on this has been provided and no further comment by you on this has been made, and you now state you will not enter into any further correspondence). My other requests for information on the old john laird unit have also gone unanswered and appear to have been ignored by your apparent decision to internal review and respond on only on what you consider to be ‘my main point of concern’, and you now state you will not enter into any further correspondence.
In relation to my requests for information on the Pyramids and Grange Shopping Centres even if you had demonstrated the prejudice (which you have not, despite being required to do so) you anyway have not included any comment as requested on the news report https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liv... which includes reference to some of the information I requested. You have not then addressed my specific questions regarding that information being published there against the information you had refused me, a refusal you have even now upheld following your apparent internal review which you state involved a review and discussion with the relevant departments of my original request, response and all additional correspondence as well as further in house legal advice. And you now state you will not enter into any further correspondence.
I hope there are no errors here similar to https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
where my request for contracts was refused by you invoking section 43, this was upheld following your internal review of that decision, and you stated legal advice had been obtained in support of this internal review, and only then once I complained to the ICO did you tell me that you were wrong to use section 43 as the contracts which you refused to provide me with as it would be prejudicial did not even exist and that the legal advice you claimed to have obtained in support of that had not actually been obtained.
For my requests on ‘Wirral Real Estate Portfolio’ here, please update your response of 31/10/2023 to make sure it is both complete and correct otherwise there will be even further delay for these requests some of which go as far back as 18/05/2023 while I am forced by your conduct to complain to the ICO.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
It is now 23 working days since my 01/11/2023 request for an internal review to which I have received no reply and part of which relates to request made back on 18/05/2023 which is 141 working days ago.
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Good Afternoon
In response to your email below please accept our apologies for the delay in dealing with your request and subsequent Internal Review. We will continue to press the service area for a response but in the meantime please note that there is no further right to input another Internal Review, if you are dissatisfied you now have the right to complain to the Information Commissioner who can be contacted at https://ico.org.uk/global/contact-us/
Many Thanks
Emma Murphy
Information Management Officer
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
It is now 193 working days since my original requests.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
It is now 212 working since my original requests.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
It is now 232 working days since my original requests.
When will I receive all of the outstanding information I have requested?
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear Mr Jones
We would refer you to our email of 31 October 2023 shown below which
clearly states the Council’s position in regards to this particular
enquiry.
Yours sincerely
Lynette Paterson
Principal Information Management Officer
Finance – Digital and Improvement
Wirral Council
PO Box 290
Brighton Street
Wallasey
CH27 9FQ
Email: [1][Wirral Borough Council request email]
Visit our website: [2]www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Corrin, Jane <[3][email address]>
Sent: 31 October 2023 12:38
To: [4][FOI #982018 email]
Cc: InfoMgr, FinDMT <[5][Wirral Borough Council request email]>
Subject: Internal Review of FOI 1652833 - JOHN JONES REAL ESTATE PORTFOLIO
Importance: High
Dear Mr Jones
I write further to your emails of 13 July, 12 August, 25 August, 11
September, 1 October and 27 October 2023, in which you requested an
internal review of the Council’s FOI response dated 11 July 2023. I
apologise for the delay in responding to you.
Your original request, response and all additional correspondence has now
been reviewed and discussed with the relevant departments. In addition to
this, further in-house legal advice has been obtained in relation to your
main point of concern - the application of the exemption at Section 43(2)
FOIA, to financial information that was considered commercially sensitive
and prejudicial to both the Council and its partners if disclosed.
In reaching that decision the public interest test was fully considered
and factors for and against disclosure were provided. Upon review and
consideration of all relevant factors and your comments, it remains the
Council’s position that the exemption was correctly applied and I uphold
the original decision.
On 25 August 2023, you included a new request for “an outline summary of
the lease structure for the Milton pavement sites”.
In response to this additional enquiry, please see the following link to
the Cabinet report of July 2020 which sets out details of the transaction
under Item 13, ‘Lease for New Offices in BCD’ -
[6]https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/document...
We trust this provides the required information.
This concludes our internal review of FOI 1652833 and no further
correspondence will be entered into, in respect of this enquiry. If you
remain dissatisfied then you have the right to complain to the Information
Commissioner’s Office, [7]www.ico.org.uk, contact details for which have
been provided previously.
Yours sincerely
Jane Corrin
ICT Governance and Compliance Manager (DPO)
ICT & Digital
Currently Working From Home – Working Pattern Tuesday to Friday
Visit our website [8]www.wirral,gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
References
Visible links
1. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
2. http://www.wirral.gov.uk/
3. mailto:[email address]
4. mailto:[FOI #982018 email]
5. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
6. https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/document...
7. http://www.ico.org.uk/
8. http://www.wirral,gov.uk/
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
And I refer you to my message of 01/11/2023.
You cannot fail to provide information and then carry out only an incomplete and defective internal review and simply state you will not correspond further.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear Mr Jones,
REF: IC-289502-Q7Y3 /ICO /FOI/IR 1652833
Please see the response outlined below about your request that was
originally submitted on 18^th May 2023. This has also been copied to the
Information Commissioners Office ICO.
1) how much was or will be paid by the council for the Grange shopping
centre, and separately how much was paid by the council for the pyramids
shopping centre, Milton pavement, and the Vue cinema, and the old Beatties
store and the shopping centre block that includes Wilko and Mecca bingo.’
The Council has reviewed its position regarding relying on a section 43
exemption (Commercially Sensitive), and the result of this is that we no
longer need to rely on that. Therefore, the Council can confirm that The
Grange and Pyramids Shopping Centre was acquired for £10,000,000 on 3rd
May 2023.
3) does / will the council own these shopping centres without ownership or
other rights being shared with other entities (if no please provide
details)’
The Council has reviewed its position regarding relying on a section 43
exemption (Commercially Sensitive), and the result of this is that we no
longer need to rely on that. Therefore, the Council can confirm that it
owns the entire freehold for the shopping centre. Individual units are
occupied by tenants who hold leasehold interests.
4) for the old John laird wetherspoons pub property did the council become
owners before or after wetherspoons left? How much rent or other income
have the council received from that property since? How much rent and
business rates and other income could the council have reasonably expected
to have received if the property had not been left empty since council
ownership began and to date? Lost income aside, how much has this unit
cost the council to keep empty over this period?’
The John Laird ‘Wetherspoons’ unit was vacant when the Council acquired
the site.
Regarding the rest of the information that you have requested for this
question, the Council has reviewed its position and can confirm that we do
not hold any information in relation to this. Therefore, the Council does
not hold the information as specified in this part of your request.
Yours sincerely
Tracy O'Hare
Information Management Technical Officer
Wirral Council
PO Box 290
Brighton Street
Wallasey
CH27 9FQ
Email:[1][Wirral Borough Council request email]
Visit our website: [2]www.wirral.gov.uk
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1. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
2. http://www.wirral.gov.uk/
Dear Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Wirral Council Real Estate Portfolio'.
REASONS -
It has taken over a year, numerous messages, internal review and ICO involvement for you to provide that information.
I asked for the separate amounts the council was paid for the Grange and the Pyramids shopping centres but, after more than a year, you have only given one combined figure.
The more than a year long wait to find out such lack of information you hold on the old john laird wetherspoons pub property, particularly on the cost to keep this unit empty over such a long period despite it being bought at huge public expense, is quite something.
You have despite my efforts and your legal duties, never responded to some of my requests for information on this unit, and your previous internal review ignored these, and you did not correct that despite me highlighting it.
Within my message of 13/07/2023 i said-
Additionally if there is any information regarding some other reason as to why the council has never considered this (relating the lost income due to the unit remaining empty) (for example a direct decision being made to keep the unit empty for some reason or perhaps there being some issue with the unit so that it must be kept empty) then please provide that.
and
Please confirm the date the unit became owned by the council.
and
Please also provide records of any contact with Wetherspoons and or their agents regarding this unit as well as records of any contacts with anyone else about the possibility of renting or making some use of this unit or of marketing it for rent or use of this unit, or internal communications, reports or notes regarding the same.
and
The cabinet report appears to be linked here
https://democracy.wirral.gov.uk/ieListDo...
That refers to ‘The strategic case for the acquisition is set out in the report below however the commercial details of the proposal is contained in the attached technical appendix which is exempt from publication due to commercial sensitivity considerations under Schedule 12A of the Local Government Act 1972.’ As 6 years has passed and the old John Laird Unit within this £8.4million property purchased by the council is still empty now please provide that technical appendix.'
-
In my foi requests on this in the last year I am trying to understand why this unit has been kept empty and boarded up for so many years despite the council having bought it at huge public expense while elsewhere including directly over the road for its own newly built state of the art offices incurring huge liabilities in order to regenerate the town centre and turn around its long standing decline. In this I am reminded of the councillor’s words in introducing the strategic case for acquisition here - “We are well on the way to achieving those targets, and making investment decisions like this one will help us drive forward the regeneration of major town centres such as Birkenhead – helping to revitalise the town, creating thousands of new jobs and quickening the pace of our exciting regeneration plans for the area. This is a bold and ambitious move. We are absolutely committed to regeneration in our borough – we will not stop until we have created a thriving local economy, where our residents have opportunity and can access good, high paying jobs on their doorsteps. This proposal is yet more proof of our commitment to that pledge. Following exciting recent announcements of a state-of-the-art student accommodation development in Hamilton Square, and the plans to open a branch of the world-renowned Eureka Children’s Museum to Wirral, it is clear that we are building real momentum. Later this year we will announce the next stage in the development of the Wirral Growth Company: a radical and ambitious new venture which will drive forward the redevelopment of many areas of our Borough. Bringing key sites such as the Europa Building into public ownership will allow us to restore Birkenhead Town Centre back to its former glory in a much quicker timeframe.”
To avoid another wait of another year please provide -
1) The separate amounts the council was paid for the grange, and for the pyramids.
2) any information regarding any reason the council has never considered the lost income due to the unit remaining empty (for example a direct decision being made to keep the unit empty for some reason or perhaps there being some issue with the unit so that it must be kept empty) And via you duty to advise and assist – please provide any information relating to any reason why the unit has been kept empty and boarded up since the council bought it at great public expense.
3) the date the unit became owned by the council
4) records of any contact with Wetherspoons and or their agents regarding this unit as well as records of any contacts with anyone else about the possibility of renting or making some use of this unit or of marketing it for rent or use of this unit, or internal communications, reports or notes regarding the same.
5) the technical appendix to the strategic case for acquisition
A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/w...
Yours faithfully,
John Jones
Dear Mr Jones
We have strong reason to believe that the name used in your requests is a
pseudonym. We have previously sought proof of identity from you under
[1][email address] and no response was
received.
Section 8 FOIA describes the criteria that a valid request under the Act
must meet, specifically Section 8(1)(b), which states that a valid request
will ‘state the name of the applicant’. The ICO has produced guidance
regarding this part of the Act, stating that:
“A requester can be an individual, a company or an organisation, but in
each case Section 8(1)(b) requires that a request for information must
include the name of the requester. In our view, the intention of the
legislation is for the requester to provide their real name so their
request could be processed in accordance with the requirements of the
FOIA.”
We therefore consider this request is invalid as it fails to meet the
requirements of Section 8(1)(b) FOIA.
Yours sincerely
Lynette Paterson
Principal Information Management Officer
Law and Corporate Services
Wirral Council
PO Box 290
Brighton Street
Wallasey
CH27 9FQ
Email: [2][Wirral Borough Council request email]
Visit our website: [3]www.wirral.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
References
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1. mailto:[email address]
2. mailto:[Wirral Borough Council request email]
3. http://www.wirral.gov.uk/
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
Please confirm –
1 the reasons you allege pseudonym
2 the legal basis for your demand for my identity papers
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
Dear InfoMgr, FinDMT,
I previously sought confirmation from you of -
1 the reasons you allege pseudonym
2 the legal basis for your demand for my identity papers
And no response has been received.
I therefore consider your unilateral declaration that my requests are invalid, to itself be invalid.
Please now comply with your legal obligations in respect of my requests without diversion or delay.
Yours sincerely,
John Jones
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John Jones left an annotation ()
An ongoing foi request of a similar nature may be of connected interest to anyone viewing this one -
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/p...