Warmfront Scheme

D. Speers made this Freedom of Information request to Department of Energy and Climate Change

The request was successful.

From: D. Speers

5 June 2009

Dear Sir or Madam,
With reference to the Warmfront Scheme:
1) How many complaints have Warmfront received in the last two
years?

2) What percentage of these complaints were regarding incorrect
boiler installations?

3) Are the installers chosen by Warmfront,the schemes preferred
suppliers?

4) As suppliers of Government services are Warmfront/Warmsure/Eaga
subject to the Goods and Services Act

5) What percentage of Warmfront's implementation costs were
allocated for subsequent repair work by their preferred suppliers?

6) Do Warmfront/Warmsure/Eaga seek tender bids from preferred
suppliers

Yours faithfully,

D. Speers

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From: FOI Requests

12 June 2009

Dear D. Speers

Thank your for your enquiry. We have checked our records and established
that we don't hold the information you requested. Defra at
www.defra.gov.uk might be in a position to help.

Regards

Information Rights Team

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D. Speers left an annotation (12 June 2009)

Quote-marks Question is:
How many people out there have been let down by the Warmfront Scheme and how many people are still waiting for resolution?

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Richard Taylor left an annotation (12 June 2009)

Quote-marks The department of Energy and Climate Change was asked:
"1) How many complaints have Warmfront received in the last two years?"

While they have given an "information not held" response. I do not think they have been particularly helpful. They might not know how may complaints Warmfront has had, but they do know how many complaints they have had about Warm Front.

The latter was revealed by an answer to a recent Parliamentary question on the 4th of June 2009 which states:

"The Department has only recorded the number of complaints it has received about Warm Front since the beginning of April this year. Up until the end of May, DECC has received 275 expressions of dissatisfaction with the scheme."

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/wrans/?id=...

Now this information has been published, DECC don't have to release it to again under FOI but they do have a duty to assist you. This also confirms they were the right department to approach with questions on Warm Front.

In my view the existence of this information raises doubt about their response with respect to the other questions.

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From: D. Speers

12 June 2009

Dear Sir or Madam,

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of
Information reviews.

I am writing to request an internal review of Department of Energy
and Climate Change's handling of my FOI request 'Warmfront Scheme'.

I am unhappy about your response to my recent FOI request and am
seeking further information via an independent review. I was
advised by Warmfront to contact DECC and you have referred me to
the DEFRA....and I shall also try there. But I believe that DECC is
the correct Department and I asked "How many complaints have
Warmfront received in the last two years?" and you responded that
"the information was not held"

On reflection you may not know how many complaints Warmfront had
but as the correct Dept you cerainly must be aware how many
complaints DECC have had about Warmfront. This was confirmed
recently in an answer to a Parliamenray question on 4th June 2009.
DECC were certainly aware because as the answer they gave via the
Minister will confirm "The Department has only recorded the number
of complaints it has received about Warmfront since the beginning
of April this year. Up until the end of may, DECC has received 275
expressions of disatisfaction with the scheme"
I realise as this information has now been published DECC dont
technically have to release it again under FOI but you do have a
public duty to assist me please. In seeking further answers as well
as an Internal Reviwe I need the other questions fully addressed
please

2) What percentage of these 275 complaints were regarding incorrect
boiler installations?

3) Are the installers chosen by Warmfront,the schemes preferred
suppliers?

4) As suppliers of Government services are Warmfront/Warmsure/Eaga
subject to the Goods and Services Act

5) What percentage of Warmfront's implementation costs were
allocated for subsequent repair work by their preferred suppliers?

6) Do Warmfront/Warmsure/Eaga seek tender bids from preferred
suppliers

A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is
available on the Internet at this address:
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wa...

Yours sincerely,

D. Speers

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From: Pather, Rishi (DECC - CEEH)
Department of Energy and Climate Change

10 July 2009

Dear Mr Speers

Thank you for your request for information about the Warm Front scheme,
which was received by the Department for Business Innovation and Skills on
5 June. Unfortunately your request was not properly forwarded. Your
request was not received by the Fuel Poverty team in the Department of
Energy and Climate Change until 6 July. I apologise for this delay. We are
dealing with your request under the Freedom of Information Act 2000.

As required by the legislation, we aim to answer your request within 20
working days from the date we received it. However on this occasion we
will be unable to meet this deadline because of the delay in forwarding
your request.

If you have any queries about this letter, please contact me. Please
remember to quote the reference number above in any future communications.

Yours sincerely

Rishi Pather

Mr Rishi Pather

Fuel Poverty Team

Department of Energy and Climate Change
+ Zone 1d, 3 Whitehall Place, London, SW1A 2HH

( 0300 068 5159

[mobile number]
: [email address]

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From: D. Speers

12 July 2009

Dear Pather, Rishi (DECC - CEEH),

Many thanks for your contact and you will note I have sent a
reminder on FOI deadlines. I am concerned that this request was
wrongly forwarded and ask if this is a training need identified?
I look forward to a comprehensive response shortly.

Yours sincerely,

D. Speers

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From: Pather, Rishi (DECC - CEEH)
Department of Energy and Climate Change

4 August 2009

Dear Mr Speers

Thank you for your request for information about the Warm Front Scheme, which was received on 6 July 2009. I provide a response to your questions:

1) How many complaints have Warm Front received in the last two years?

eaga plc, the Scheme Manager for the Warm Front Scheme received 5,321complaints in 2008-09 and 1,422 complaints, to date, in 2009-10.

2) What percentage of these complaints were regarding incorrect boiler installations?

eaga plc received 1,433 complaints in 2008-09 and 144 complaints, to date, in 2009-10 regarding boiler installations.

3) Are the installers chosen by Warm Front, the scheme’s preferred suppliers?

Installers are appointed to work on the Warm Front Scheme via a competitive tender process.

4) As suppliers of Government services are Warm Front/ WarmSure/ eaga subject to the Goods and Services Act

Yes

5) What percentage of Warm Front's implementation costs were allocated for subsequent repair work by their preferred suppliers?

The cost of any remedial work that needs to be undertaken following installation is met by the installer and not the Warm Front Scheme.

6) Do Warm Front/ WarmSure/ eaga seek tender bids from preferred suppliers?

See response to Q3. The competitive tender process is open to all installers who feel they meet the criteria required to work on the Scheme.

Yours sincerely

Rishi Pather

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From: D. Speers

4 August 2009

Dear Pather, Rishi (DECC - CEEH),

Many thanks for your response and the figures you quote are indeed
very worrying. I would argue that a scheme receiving an average of
443 complaints per month per annum, of which 203 per month are
related to boiler installations is fundamentally flawed and must be
addressed. Maybe the final sentence would give a clue as to where
the problem may be?:

" The competitive tender process is open to all installers who feel
they meet the criteria required to work on the Scheme."

Should maybe the criteria be be left to chance? set by the scheme?
or should the installers have to provide evidence of compliance
before undertaking work in people's homes?

Thanks again

Yours sincerely,

D. Speers

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Brian Fish left an annotation (29 January 2010)

Quote-marks Mr Speers the reply that the Eaga Scheme is open to all is incorrect we are a heating company who do not have client complaints but apparently are not to Eaga`s standards.
The truth of the matter is that 30% of the work goes directly to Eaga`s own company. There are then only 4 to 5 contractors allowed in each area (20 areas) therefore there is no way that small experienced contractors can be placed on the list, as the throughput would not be there with 4 to 5 contractors.
You then have large companies close to Eaga winning the tenders with all the variance of workmanship this brings.
They also have an agreement with Ideal boilers which is in my opinion unhealthy and regarded by many as a poor range of boilers.
There is a petition you can review at Downing Street regarding the whole process, but the whole issue has simply been paid lip service with a stock Eaga reply.

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D. Speers left an annotation (29 January 2010)

Quote-marks 2008: http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations...

2009: I asked under FOI from the excellent www.whatdotheyknow.com site: http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wa...

How many Warm Front complaints have DECC been made aware of?
“In terms of complaints received by the Scheme Manager, we can advise
that the total figure for complaints received from 1 June 2005 through
to 31 December 2009 is 17,737”.
I have sent this to Paddy Tipping MP and in the light of Brian's annotation, there are serious matters which need addressing.
I have suggested: "As MPs are planning to review the Warmfront sceme, please can you confirm with the first question: “where the ‘additional £250 million that was made available’ has been spent?”

Maybe the second question should be: What have Eaga done about the ‘17,737’ complaints received so far?”

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Karl Murray left an annotation (14 September 2010)

Quote-marks I have personally worked with the warm front agents, I would say they do work 100% and the quality of the engineers I have been with is excellent.

I would say however the Icon boilers are substandard but again... you get what you pay for. Nothing in this life is really free or discounted.

I would suggest to any person looking for a new boiler install to think about the future cost rather than the initial installation cost.

Get quotes rather than just looking for a rebate. If it is for free.. then why even question it. The engineers will be getting paid peanuts so they wont want to be on the job for more than one day.

Gas work is a profession and with the lay out cost of every install engineer (Qualification, registration, labour, tools, van etc etc the list is really endless) Then there will be a cost involved.

Think with your head not your pocket.

Regards

Karl

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D. Speers left an annotation (14 September 2010)

Quote-marks Thanks Karl,
I am really pleased you are working with dedicated professionals and sadly you seem to be the exception rather than the rule. You're right of course, as the saying goes, there's no such thing as a free lunch....and believe me none of the boilers I have heard about have been free!

But for a gas professional to leave homes in a state of disrepair (loose floorboards, incorrect plumbing leading to floods, live pipework, holes in floors etc!) is nothing short of negligent. The Icon boilers may not be the best there are, but can only be afforded by some of us....and they don't fit themselves!

If the engineers are " getting paid peanuts" is that the fault of the person who has to tolerate the fact "they wont want to be on the job for more than one day?"

You have the right to expect a fair wage, in exchange for a fair days work. We have the right to expect ourselves and our homes to be treated with respect.

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Brian Fish left an annotation (16 September 2010)

Quote-marks Karl,

I am a private installer and along with many other installers have been objecting to the situation of Eaga Plc for years.
We even met with the National Energy Agency to express our concerns with Eaga and specifically the standard of boilers used.
At that meeting we made it quite clear that there are some V-good boiler companies in the UK which will immediately give Eaga a 5 to 7 year parts and labour warranty on their boilers and that the installation costs could be reduced if managed through small private companies.
Mrs Saunders CEO of the NEA believed this was only due to the economic situation (which is untrue) and made no excuse for the good that Eaga have done?
The fact is that Eaga install a cheap boiler, charge maximum unit prices and make vast profits at the expense of the tax payer.
As you have pointed out the installers have improved recently, but the engineers are now receiving less per install, when the charges to the tax payer remain the same?
The 2 year warranty on the Ideal boilers is a standard manufacturers warranty, the greater risk period is thereafter and to simply leave for the most vulnerable people of society to fund the cost of a replacement boiler or repair, when they can ill afford it, is a disgrace!!!!
5 years AI cover should have been the "minimum bench mark" for any manufacturer entering the tender process, it not only gives the householder peace of mind but would reflects a "value for money" return for the tax payer.
The fundamental principles of the scheme are excellent, however the last Government and the DECC should hang their heads in shame after such a monumental waist of money when more people could have benefitted.
The Eaga funding for installations should stop immediately, leaving them to do the admin only, then give locally approved and trusted private sector installers the installation work, at a reduced cost / bidding arrangement, with a manufacturer boiler warranty of 5 year cover.
These installations should then be inspected by an independent third party (Local Authority) to prevent an unhealthy interest for Eaga to withhold money or fine any of the companies.

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D. Speers left an annotation (16 September 2010)

Quote-marks Thank you Brian for a more fully balanced view. Hopefully this new administration will look at what the smaller companies have to offer and I note the coalition are looking at The DECC Structural Reform Plan

The site info states:
Structural Reform Plans are the key tool of the coalition government for holding departments to account on the implementation of the reforms set out in the coalition agreement. Our plan sets out our top four departmental priorities, which are to:

1. Save energy with the Green Deal and support vulnerable consumers
2. Deliver secure energy on the way to a low carbon energy future
3. Drive ambitious action on climate change at home and abroad
4. Manage our energy legacy responsibly and cost-effectively.

* Department of Energy & Climate Change: draft structural reform plan [filetype:pdf filesize: 90.51Kb]

If you would like to comment on DECC’s draft Structural Reform Plan please send your views to StructuralReformPlan@decc.gsi.gov.uk.http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/ab...

I think your well informed comments should be sent for consultation process. I believe #4 is your focus in this.
Good luck
Dee

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Mr F Kendrick left an annotation (20 September 2010)

Quote-marks can anyone tell me why i am charged a £50-00p ADMIN FEE
when i claim from the £300-00p REBATE SCHEME.
my understanding of EAGA / WARM FRONT that it is a government funded organisation, that means it is paid by the Government to run it, if they have been paid then why are they charging me effectively being paid twice for the same job ????

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D. Speers left an annotation (20 September 2010)

Quote-marks Sorry, I have no idea why you are seemingly being changed twice for the same job. But a good question and one maybe you could ask the Secretary of State http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/ab... or Eaga complaints Lisa.Hodges@eaga.com
Please let us know what they say by adding another annotation.

Thanks Dee

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Mr. Ward. left an annotation ( 5 October 2010)

Quote-marks Thankyou to D.Speers for the information posted regarding Warmfront. My battle has gone on for ten months with absolutely no help from Warmfront, Eagre,DECC, Ideal Boilers and finally Chris Huhne himself. There is absolutely no justice and the Warmfront scheme is a diabolical waste of taxpayers money.

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D. Speers left an annotation ( 5 October 2010)

Quote-marks Dear Mr Ward,

The only way to get anything done is to keep badgering the complaints system. Send photos, letters and anything you can to draw them out......go to the press! But it looks like this is the reason they are all diving for cover http://www.eastleighnews.org.uk/news/?p=...
My home was flooded by an incorrectly fitted boiler and it took over a year to get resolution. In fact my kitchen has just been completed.

Keep seeking answers!
Dee

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crispy left an annotation ( 8 October 2010)

Quote-marks The simpliest way forward for customers is to ask for the warmfront specification Ts 142 or Ts 110 which is the for all works carried out on the grant and what is required. All insallers wheather direct or contractors must abide to it.

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Mr. Ward. left an annotation ( 9 October 2010)

Quote-marks Many thanks to D.Speers and Crispy, info. greatly appreciated. I will be contacting Warmfront Monday am to forward me the details you have described.
Once again, many thanks.

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D. Speers left an annotation ( 9 October 2010)

Quote-marks Yes, BIG thanks to Crispy, much appreciated.

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D. Speers left an annotation ( 9 October 2010)

Quote-marks http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theoneshow/co...

This blog will give you some idea of the tricks pulled!
My boiler flooded my downstairs (incorrectly fitted condense pipe!)and I needed to have a new kitchen and floor fitted.
Thankfully after 18 months of hassle, I seem to be getting somewhere!

Thank you all for your questioning.
Dee Speers

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Mr. Ward. left an annotation (10 October 2010)

Quote-marks I am so relieved to hear other problems with Warmfront, thought we were alone in this.!!!!!
My daughters Ideal Isaar broke down 2 months after gaurantee ran out. All last winter was eight degrees in house. No heating or hot water for 10 months. No-one will help not even Chris Huhn MP. My daughter has heart trouble, spinal arthritis and thyroid problems and carrying boiling water upstairs to wash. Warmfront say she no longer qualifies yet there is still £900 `in her pot`. Who is holding that Government money? I was going to Small Claims court with this but I`m told if I lose I will have to pay top Lawyer costs for Warmfront. Is there not a Solicitor out there who can take up a joint claim. Many thanks to everyone for advice.

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D. Speers left an annotation (10 October 2010)

Quote-marks Hi Mr Ward,
There is a very professional company in London who may consider this.
Have a look at www.leighday.co.uk.....as your daughter has health issues they may look at a clinical negligence claim........under a conditional fee agreeement? Always worth exploring and they wont charge for consultation.
Speak to Emma Jones PA to Frances Swaine in the Human Rights Dept and you can mention me if you want. No harm exploring this and happy to help wherever I can.

Also so that you feel less alone, http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations... be assured MPs have been discussing this for some time....and number of complaints have been mentioned in Hansard.

So if Chris Hune is still blocking you, suggest you try the Energy and Climate Change select Committee (here's the membership list: http://www.parliament.uk/business/commit... Chris Hune is accountable too!....allegedly!

Good luck

Kind Regards
Dee

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D. Speers left an annotation (10 October 2010)

Quote-marks Please be aware you may need to access the new Energy and Climate Change Select Committee lists from Parliament. I may have given you previous list.....http://www.parliament.uk/business/commit...

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crispy left an annotation (18 October 2010)

Quote-marks If you have trouble obtaining Ts142 and Ts 110 would be able to post copies obtained that were left in my posession.

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D. Speers left an annotation (19 October 2010)

Quote-marks Thank you Crispy, I will pass on the info and see what is required. Any info you can post online re how to access info is very helpful.
Thank you
Dee

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Mr. Ward. left an annotation (19 October 2010)

Quote-marks Hi,I very much appreciate your offer but I have now had to pay British Gas £150 for an urgent repair as I could not face another winter like last year.
I`m afraid there is a no win situation against Warmfront who just deny any accusations against them and have the backing of Chris Huhn MP.
Taxpayers money is being squandered disgracefully here as the Government will not listen to the thousands of complaints. If I risk taking Warmfront to the small claims court, and lost, I would be liable for Warmfronts legal team costs which would be massive.
Thankyou to Crispy and D. Speers.

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D. Speers left an annotation (19 October 2010)

Quote-marks Sorry to hear you have been put in this position...is your MP any good?
If he/she is then maybe a surgery meeting and ask hi/her to write to Chris Huhne on your behalf. Info on MPs can be found at www.theyworkforyou.com.
You can also seek some answers from the Select Committee http://www.parliament.uk/business/commit... and maybe the local press?
Depends on how much energy you still have!

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D. Speers left an annotation (20 October 2010)

Quote-marks I believe I heard in today's financial review that Warmfront is being dropped.

We were told Warm Front is intended to "provide support to vulnerable groups in, or at risk of, fuel poverty. This typically includes low income households and families and disabled" it begs the question 'What is going to replace it and what will happen to resolve current complaints'??

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D. Speers left an annotation (20 October 2010)

Quote-marks Have made contact with the ECCC:
"Dear ECCC Team,

I heard today on the Chancellor’s Financial Review that Warmfront was being axed. This scheme was intended for households with Fuel Poverty risks, I believe.

Therefore can you please advise:

What is going to replace it?

What happens to outstanding Warmfront complaints?

What happens to monies owed after complaints have been technically resolved?

With thanks for your time.

Kind Regards

Dee Speers

ps Don't hold your breath!

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Mr. Ward. left an annotation (21 October 2010)

Quote-marks What a surprise, I cannot believe it!!!
But, I think this is the correct way forward as the Government are lining the pockets of some, if not all,`Cowboy` traders.
I am happy that the `cowboys` who fitted my daughters system will be out of business as will, hopefully, the arrogant Warmfront Managers.
Ideal Boilers should be made responsible for the thousands of complaints.
Thankyou D. Speers, you have made my day.
Here`s hoping the DECC will come up with a better managed scheme for the disabled and needy.

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D. Speers left an annotation (21 October 2010)

Quote-marks Yes, I certainly hope so too and if you trawl the Warmfront questions asked on the wonderful site, you will see sadly you are not alone!
Good luck
Dee

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Sarah left an annotation (25 October 2010)

Quote-marks Hi to all. I am so grateful that myself and my family are not alone regarding problems with WARMFRONT. I applied November 2009 for loft insulation as the roof is in serious need of it. After around 3 months a women representing the scheme inspected my loft and put me on a (up to 3 month) waiting list).

Since then I have contacted them constantly to find out what is happening regarding the application, with no JOY. In July I was contacted by a man regarding a new boiler. From our conversation I was amazed to find out that WARM FRONT had requested a new boiler even though the boiler is fairly new and has been recently serviced. The man stated even if he came out to check the boiler (which had nothing wrong with it) he would find nothing wrong with the boiler therefore being pointless to come out to us. He apologised for the waisted time and said it wasn't the first time this had happened.

I contacted WARM FRONT regarding this and was told the reason why no loft insulation has been installed is due to the fact that we were on the waiting list for a new boiler. I was disgusted at this and made my opinions clear and requested I needed the insulation before the cold weather comes and I had never asked for a boiler. WARM FRONT told me it would be done in the next 6 weeks (latest by end of September).

I called them 1st October and was told it may take up to 3 months for the job to be done.

My husband is disabled with chronic asthma of which my daughter suffers from. We constantly have the heating on and off throughout the night as the frosty weather is now causing dampness on the ceilings and showing effects on our health.

If nothing is done soon I will have to borrow the money to get the loft insulated ourselves as the effects of the cold weather coming is frightening.

Does anyone know of any other ways to access funds for loft insulation?

Sarah

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Sarah left an annotation (25 October 2010)

Quote-marks Hi to all. I am so grateful that myself and my family are not alone regarding problems with WARMFRONT. I applied November 2009 for loft insulation as the roof is in serious need of it. After around 3 months a women representing the scheme inspected my loft and put me on a (up to 3 month) waiting list).

Since then I have contacted them constantly to find out what is happening regarding the application, with no JOY. In July I was contacted by a man regarding a new boiler. From our conversation I was amazed to find out that WARM FRONT had requested a new boiler even though the boiler is fairly new and has been recently serviced. The man stated even if he came out to check the boiler (which had nothing wrong with it) he would find nothing wrong with the boiler therefore being pointless to come out to us. He apologised for the waisted time and said it wasn't the first time this had happened.

I contacted WARM FRONT regarding this and was told the reason why no loft insulation has been installed is due to the fact that we were on the waiting list for a new boiler. I was disgusted at this and made my opinions clear and requested I needed the insulation before the cold weather comes and I had never asked for a boiler. WARM FRONT told me it would be done in the next 6 weeks (latest by end of September).

I called them 1st October and was told it may take up to 3 months for the job to be done.

My husband is disabled with chronic asthma of which my daughter suffers from. We constantly have the heating on and off throughout the night as the frosty weather is now causing dampness on the ceilings and showing effects on our health.

If nothing is done soon I will have to borrow the money to get the loft insulated ourselves as the effects of the cold weather coming is frightening.

Does anyone know of any other ways to access funds for loft insulation?

Sarah

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javid left an annotation (28 October 2010)

Quote-marks I have had a warmfront technical surveyor come out on 04/10/10. He carried out the assessment and recommended an ideal boiler.
I have had previous experience of warmfront with them trying to recommend an ideal isar at my parents property. After reading "...avoid these boilers like the plague!!" on a review site i kicked up a fuss and requested another assessment. They agreed and fitted a vaillant!

So with that in mind I asked the surveyor if there was another make of boiler he could recommend before i signed. He asked me quite casually "what do you want?" i said vaillant and straight away amended both his and my copy of the printout with Vaillant ecotec plus 31. I signed both and he was on his way.

Fantastic i thought until i rang warmfront/eaga to double check. The chap on the phone said they have no record of the amendment and that they only install vaillant on a technicality. what does that mean? I explained that i signed two copies one of which i have in front of me but he refused to acknowledge this. I rang the surveyor to double check he confirmed amending both copies. I've requested a manager to give me a call back.

It was taken up by a certain Zoe on their escalations team. She requested to see the copy of the contract/survey so i faxed it over along with a cover sheet requesting to be only called after 2 in the afternoon as that is when i finish work. when she did try to call it was always in the morning and i had to call up and ask to be called after 2. She did this only once and unfortunately i missed her call.

I rang up again yesterday only to find that she had closed the esacalation stating the issue was resolved. Apparently i can't have what was written in the contract because a reason wasn't given to them. i said that this wasn't made clear to me during the survey therefore i would appreciate it if they honour it. i have asked for the complaint to be re opened and have also complained to DECC who have only passed me back to warmfront.

Any ideas as to where i stand with this?

cheers
Jav

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D. Speers left an annotation (28 October 2010)

Quote-marks Sarah and Jav......thanks for your stories, sorry I have no idea about where to go next. Like you I have had appalling dealings with Warmfront/Eaga.
Can only suggest approaching your MPs and seeking answers from Dept of Energy and Climate Change (DECC) Minister Chris Huhne!

You can write an online letter at www.writetothem.com (a sister site of this excellent one) And to find out about your MPs work ethic try www.theyworkforyou.com
Good luck
Dee

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D. Speers left an annotation (28 October 2010)

Quote-marks Hold fire, #
I have had an email from DECC and will post it here later....not sure what its about but I have asked DECC about Warmfronts proposed closure.
Will keep you posted
Dee

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Mr. Ward. left an annotation (28 October 2010)

Quote-marks I met my MP, Ed Milliband, by appointment regarding the distress my daughter was suffering due to a broken down boiler lasting ten months. He was appalled and said his only option was to pass my letter to Chris Huhne.Ed Milliband had said if Labour had been voted in he would have sorted this out and, yes, I believe he would have.
However,I did get a reply from Chris Huhne who,quite candidly, wrote `This boiler was two months out of guarantee so there is nothing to be done`.
Trying to get help from these people is a total waste of time and money,one might as well write to God in Heaven as he is more likely to help.

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D. Speers left an annotation (28 October 2010)

Quote-marks Mr Ward, Couldn't agree more and Labour were in when all this chaos was happening yet did nothing to allivate it, in fact Milliband was ECC Minister.....where was he when the thousands of complaints were coming in? ....who are they kidding!? Tell Milliband and Huhne that you are making a formal complaint to the Energy and Claimate Change Select Committee and you are copying it to the press! N.Lakhani@independent.co.uk may be interested in your story
How dare they!
http://www.parliament.uk/business/commit...

This is the letter I have received from DECC and it may be worth noting the last sentence

Department of Energy & Climate Change
3 Whitehall Place
London
SW1A 2AW
www.decc.gov.uk

Our ref: TO2010/08992

27 October 2010

Dear Ms Speers,

Thank you for your email of 21 October about the future of the Warm Front Scheme.

Going forward, the Green Deal is a key element of our policy to improve household energy efficiency. It will help protect people against price rises through greater energy saving, with special support for the most vulnerable. The new Energy Company Obligation will provide additional help for the vulnerable and those in hard to treat homes who may need additional support. Warm Front will continue until the Green Deal is launched.

The complaints procedure for Warm Front will not change; any outstanding complaints will be dealt with accordingly.

Yours sincerely,

Richard Bancroft
DECC Correspondence Unit

Good luck
Dee

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Nadim Qureshi left an annotation ( 7 December 2010)

Quote-marks I spoke to Warmfront yesterday to chase progress on my application which involves a boiler installation as on Sunday our existing boiler just completely broke down. Had I not done this I would not have known that Warmfront had somehow lost my application during an administrative system switch-over at their end. I should have according to their system been seen to 6 months within the date of the assessment which took place 25.03.10. A chap called Miles was helpful in trying to get me installers allocated and asked me to ring up today to find out who they were.He also informed me that the work should be done within 2-3 weeks as parts took 2 weeks to order. He also said given my situation I could have 2 electric heaters in 48hrs until the installers came. As requested by Miles I contacted Warmfront today and I too spoke to a Zoe who informed and worried me that Miles should not have done what he did as he was not allowed too!!! Huuuh??? The electric heaters would not be there in 48hrs. Never less I was able to find out who the installers are. They are Gavin Ward Ltd, who are listed as plumbers and builders who according to their various websites appear only to do the Warmfront Scheme as their work as a company.I spoke to Linda the operator at Gavin Ward who said she couldn't give me date as to when the installer will be out and they will be in touch with me to give a date and time and also that they would be trying to get it this side of Christmas. Having read all the above blogs I am getting worried. I am unemployed and have 5 children the youngest being 10years old. We don't have running hot water and no central heating. We are relying on one gas fire in the front room and the gas cooker with one electric fan heater. Any tips from anyone on how I should proceed as regards Warmfront????

Link to this

Mr. Ward. left an annotation ( 9 December 2010)

Quote-marks Your situation does not surprise me.Warmfront staff do not care a jot about anyones trauma as I have seen over the last two years. They may as well say `tough`when we try to explain the terrible situation we are in. Even Government intervention cannot move these people to do their job properly.
As you all know, my daughter suffered for a year during below zero temperatures, but ended up paying £150 for British Gas to repair her faulty system.
Then, last Thursday, my son an epileptic, had a complete boiler breakdown after the second yearly service. I rang Warmfront who said someone would be along on TUESDAY. I COMPLAINED BUT GOT NO SYMPATHY AT ALL so booked the job for Tuesday. My son had a day off work, but as expected, no-one arrived.
Yes we are in Yorkshire and it is freezing but could we at least have had a`phone call to inform us. I had asked if I could get my own plumber and send them the bill as there is still unspent money in my grant. I was told `No we will not pay any company you call out, it has to be us who do the repair`.
I tried `phoning every 15 minutes from Wednesday morning but got a recorded message that they were too busy, please try later. I still haven`t got through nearly a week later.
This company,and most of their chosen contractors are a joke and have driven me crazy over the last year.
I hope you fare better than we have. Good Luck.

Link to this

mrs jean brittain left an annotation (31 December 2010)

Quote-marks what a lot of useful information all of which is covered up by by installers and warm front. Have had major problems with installation, flooding pipes incorrect, floors taken up, carpets not replaced, the list is endless and i am disabled. Yet to have final inspection but expect nothing but trouble - the contact with warm front non existent recorded messages the same with warm sure. Do not like to say it as would not wish problems on anyone, but thought we were on our own regarding problems , obviously not. Good luck to all with problems stick it out and do not be put off fight for right to be treated with respect and have any problems solved without hassle and so sorry for all the genuine small firms who have never been given a chance all i get from installers is sob stories of profit of only £300 and have worked within this limit - no good to me when such poor quality and unable to get satisfactory answers.

Link to this

Sarah left an annotation ( 2 January 2011)

Quote-marks Hi all
Well finally in November (after a years wait) we were contacted by warm front saying a contractor was ready to install loft insullation. We were overjoyed as we had been told it would be after the Christmas period origionally. It took several hours to clear the loft space and the contractors came. They were very polite and professional showing the upmost respect for our property. I could not believe when one of them stated they were not paid for travelling time and only paid for the work they actually did which was £40 per loft between two of them. They had already travelled that morning 140 miles and the property they had been to before ours had not even cleared their loft space, so due to health and safety and insurance reasons they could not do the job and therefore were not paid for this. Eventually they finished our loft and left. My husband inspected the job to find only 200mm had been put down Not the 270 as stated beforehand. We put everything back in the loft as our house looked like a battlefield and was not ideal for the kids. Some time after the Warm Front inspector came and was not happy to see that the recommended 270mm had not been laid and the contractors had to come out again. Therefore emptying the loft taking time off work and putting us out yet again. It does make us wonder if it would have been better to have just done it ourselves, but to be honest along with the small amount of origional insullation and the warm front insullation on top we are very grateful to have had a warmer house at this cold time of year. Hope you all have a lucky, happy and stress free NEW YEAR.

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation ( 6 January 2011)

Quote-marks Thank you all for you annotations and wishing you a Happy New Year. I suppose the only way to get accountability is to keep pestering your MPs. I believe, Warmfront has been abolished and I'm not sure whats replaced it or how the Warmfront Complaints will be dealt with. Its worth pushing at the doors of DEFRA for accountability.....but you will need patience!
http://www.defra.gov.uk/search/results.h...

Tell them "Accountability is about high performance and not fear or stress.

It’s about being willing to hold yourself to a standard that improves the performance of your organization and also having a willingness to be held accountable by others."
Good luck!

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation ( 3 December 2011)

Quote-marks Andrew Chapman writes, given previous posting you may find the following on interest ?

http://www.parliament.uk/business/news/2...

Mr Varley: I understand exactly where you are
coming from. We are actually going through a subcontractor
re-tender process at this moment in
time

Q98 Mr Carswell: That is a yes.

Mr Varley:Yes, we had 1700 applications and we do
take people on if they meet the criteria during the
process. We have taken on six across the last year
and indeed we have written to yourself and a number
of colleagues to say if you do have them please let us
know who those good installers are and we will have
a look at them. What we cannot compromise on are
the health and safety standards of that installer,
whether they are ®nancially stable and the quality of
work. They are the three key hurdles that we expect
installers to get over before they can get onto the
Scheme, but in answer to your question, yes, I will
absolutely have a look at them.

Q91 Geraldine Smith: Can I ask eaga ®nally what are
you going to do to improve your customer service
and your aftercare? I do not like the fact that I have
to sort out so many issues for constituents, I do not
think they should have to come to their MP, you
should have sorted it out earlier. We have seen a
letter and photographs showing quite poor
workmanship, so there is an issue here and I want
assurances from you that you are aware of that and
you are going to address it.

Mr Varley: You are absolutely right, we do not
always get it right and I know it is my job to make it
better and to put that right. The complaint rate is
about 0.5% across the Scheme and on every single
one of those jobs that I ®nd where it has not been
done correctly I will absolutely make it my job to go
and put it right. They are not just words, we do go
and put it right but I can only put it right when I
know that it has gone wrong.We are putting in place
improvement programmes with our sub-contractors
and with all our installers to ensure that there is a
renewed focus on making sure that the customer is
at the heart of everything they do, that they are going
out there and they are ringing the customer and we
are absolutely checking that. We operate a rigorous
installer ratings system which looks at a number of
things. It looks at how long it has taken to do the
work in the ®rst place, how long from the point that
the customer applied, the waiting times, but what we
also look at is the complaint rate of installers and the amount of work that they get is predicated on those
two things, which is around getting a quality and a
timely service to these customers that need it. I know
we can improve, I am absolutely committed to
improving and I know it is my job to make sure that
that happens.

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation ( 3 December 2011)

Quote-marks Questions 111±120 (Dr Pugh): Price of Ideal boilers compared to the next best boilers

The Ideal boilers selected for the Scheme by Defra all met stringent performance criteria in terms of being highly efficient and reliable at the tender stage.

Additionally, the boilers all accepted by the Grant Aided heating Installers Network, GAIN, as being the most reliable boilers in the market at that time.

The purchase of boilers for use on the Scheme is made from Wolseley plc and no pro®t is made by eaga in their procurement. The two most common boilers installed under the Scheme are the Ideal ISAR 24HE Condensing Combi and the Ideal ISAR 30 HE Condensing Combi.

A comparison of the price of these boilers has shown that:

Ð the prices obtained under the Scheme are 5% (for ISAR 24HE) and 8% (for ISAR 30HE) cheaper than the average price for the next three comparable boilers manufactured by Worcester, Baxi and Vallant; and

Ð the prices obtained under the Scheme are £447 (for ISAR 24HE) and £518 (for ISAR 30HE) which is signi®cantly cheaper than the ªtrade listº prices for these boilers.

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation ( 4 December 2011)

Quote-marks Oh dear it really doesn't seem to get any better......just got to keep pushing for justice!

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation ( 4 December 2011)

Quote-marks Dee, Oh yes it does !!

In 2010/11, the high level of demand for the scheme continued throughout the year, leading to DECC announcing in December that the scheme would be temporarily closed to new applications, due to the budget being fully allocated.

Whilst we may not have been able to accept new applicants for a few months, installations continued throughout this period, and we installed 56,000 heating measures and 20,000 insulation measures for those applicants who had already registered for the scheme prior to the temporary closure.

I would very much like to express my gratitude to everyone involved in delivering Warm Front. The temporary closure to the scheme for new applications, coupled with the very cold winter weather conditions meant that we have had to work through an extremely challenging period. I would like to thank our installers, local and voluntary organisations,
and all our other stakeholders for all of their support and hard work in continuing to deliver
the scheme in these challenging circumstances.

I am delighted that we have agreed with DECC a contract extension to deliver Warm Front
for a further two years. In April 2011, Eaga was acquired by Carillion Plc, and now operates
as a wholly owned subsidiary, Carillion Energy Services. Whilst the name may have changed, our commitment to delivering Warm Front to the best of our ability, and the pride we take in the positive changes that the scheme can and does make to the daily lives of our customers remains absolutely unchanged.

The outcome of the Spending Review in October 2010 resulted in difficult funding decisions
across Government. The reduction in the Warm Front budget for the final two years of the
scheme has led to a number of changes to the eligibility criteria that will ensure help is
targeted at the most vulnerable households living in the least thermally efficient properties.

These changes are explained later in this report.

It is estimated that the number of people in fuel poverty in 2010 in England was 4 million.

Against this background, the work of Warm Front has never been more important, and
its impact never more meaningful. I remain hugely proud of the work we do and the
way in which we do it, and I look forward to continuing to make a positive impact for our
customers in the coming year.

Ross Armstrong

Central Services Director
Carillion Energy Services

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation ( 4 December 2011)

Quote-marks Dear Ross Armstrong via Andrew,
Naturally I am delighted that there appears to have been a huge improvement in the Warmfront scheme and if this is a reality then of course I will be the first to congratulate DECC for "learning lessons" from the hundreds of complaints it has received, many can be clearly evidenced as the information above and link will show: http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations....

Just to really ensure the lessons learnt are "openness and transparency,can you now publish here:
1) a telephone number for complainants to initially use.
2) A precis of Carillion plc complaints process.
3) An identifiable manager who will accept escalated complaints if necessary.

It really is good news if the improvements you have identified are in place and I too look forward to Carillion and DECC making a positive impact for its
customers in the coming year. Please note: I have not said "continuing" as clearly there have been major issues which still need resolving.

Thank you
Dee

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation (12 December 2011)

Quote-marks http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa...

The Warm Front Scheme - Public Accounts Committee Contents

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2 Contract management

10. The Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs contracted out the management of the Scheme to eaga plc in 2005. Since letting the contract, the Scheme has changed from a relatively small contract into a major programme. Government funding has increased significantly and by 2010-11 some £1,811 million will have been invested in the Scheme (Figure 3). The Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs established a Warm Front Scheme board which includes representatives from consumer organisations and eaga plc to oversee the contract and financial performance. Three changes were made to the contract in 2006, but it did not appoint a manager to oversee day to day performance until the summer of 2007.[14]

Figure 3: Scheme funding, 2005-06 to 2010-2011

Source: C&AG's Report, Figure 3

11. The absence of day to day professional oversight of the Scheme has led to difficulties in contract management. For example:

The contract between the Department and eaga plc includes a profit share arrangement, where any profits over 11% are shared equally between the two parties. In April 2008, incorrect profit calculations in the 2006 and 2007 cost certificates were identified, which resulted in eaga plc paying back £652,000 to the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs.[15]
eaga plc owned subsidiaries can carry out up to 30% of installation work under the Scheme. The Department has recently reviewed the clause because of confusion between the two parties as to whether the limit related to the value of work or number of jobs, or whether the percentage is measured each year or over the lifetime of the contract. It has been determined that the clause relates to the value of the work undertaken. In 2007-08, work by eaga's subsidiaries accounted for 30% of the overall value of work and 31% of all jobs completed.[16]

The profit share arrangement does not include any profits generated by eaga's seven subsidiaries for other work undertaken in relation to the Scheme, for which eaga group received £95 million in income in 2007-08.[17]

As part of its original tender, eaga plc had noted that transferring the contracts for the supply of heating materials from the Department to the contractor would attract a lower VAT rate of 5%, resulting in annual savings to the Scheme of over £5 million a year.[18]

12. The cost of works is a common complaint about the Scheme. Under current Scheme rules, customers are unable to obtain alternative quotes or use their own contractors. Only contractors on the eaga panel of contractors are able to undertake work. The National Audit Office undertook a cost comparison for seven of the most common installation works undertaken by the Scheme and found that prices charged by the Scheme were competitive compared to industry averages (Figure 4). Gas and oil boiler replacements were at the top end of the range of costs modelled. The boiler of choice on the Scheme is an Ideal boiler, although the qualified engineer may determine that another boiler is more appropriate in some circumstances. The boilers are procured from Wolsley Plc through Plumb Centre under a five year contract and eaga does not make any profit on the cost of the actual boiler. In 2009, the Department and eaga were in mid-contract negotiations, including about the scope to secure cost savings in the supply of materials.[19]

Figure 4: Cost comparison of Scheme measures

Note: All figures exclude VAT. The Building Research Establishment (BRE) model is based on four dwelling types chosen to represent the target group for the Scheme: two-bedroom mid terrace house, 3-bedroom semi detached house, 3-bedroom detached bungalow and 2-bedroom low rise top floor flat. The price ranges reflect estimated costs for work on these types of dwelling, adjusted to reflect regional differences in the costs of works.

Source: C&AG's Report, Figure 14

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation (12 December 2011)

Quote-marks -----Original Message-----
From: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx>
To: ross.armstrong <ross.armstrong@carillionplc.com>
CC: customer.management <customer.management@carillionplc.com>; enquiry <enquiry@carillionplc.com>
Sent: Mon, 12 Dec 2011 1:10
Subject: Warm Front Scheme - Customer Complaints

For the attention of Mr Ross Armstrong.

Dear Mr Armstrong,

Maybe you would be good enough to post a reply directly on the following website to Dee Speers?

Yours sincerely,

Andrew Chapman

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wa...

D. Speers left an annotation (4 December 2011)

Dear Ross Armstrong (via Andrew),

Naturally I am delighted that there appears to have been a huge improvement in the Warmfront scheme and if this is a reality then of course I will be the first to congratulate DECC for "learning lessons" from the hundreds of complaints it has received, many can be clearly evidenced as the information above and link will show: http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations....

Just to really ensure the lessons learnt are "openness and transparency,can you now publish here:
1) a telephone number for complainants to initially use.
2) A precis of Carillion plc complaints process.
3) An identifiable manager who will accept escalated complaints if necessary.

It really is good news if the improvements you have identified are in place and I too look forward to Carillion and DECC making a positive impact for its
customers in the coming year. Please note: I have not said "continuing" as clearly there have been major issues which still need resolving.

Thank you

Dee

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-----Original Message-----
From: Customer Management <Customer.Management@carillionplc.com>
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Mon, 12 Dec 2011 1:10
Subject: RE: Warm Front Scheme - Customer Complaints

Thank you for your email.

We will assign your email as soon as possible. However, if your enquiry
is urgent, please contact our Customer Service Centre on 0800 316 6011.

With best regards

Customer Management

Warm Front

CARILLION VALUES

Openness - Collaboration - Mutual Dependency - Professional Delivery
-Sustainable Profitable Growth - Innovation

**********************************************************************

This e-mail transmission, including any attachments, is confidential to the intended recipient. It may contain privileged and confidential information. If
you have received this e-mail in error, please delete it and notify the postmaster@carillionplc.com. You must not disclose its contents to anyone, retain, copy, distribute or take action in reliance upon it.

Carillion may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring.

Carillion plc: Registered in England No. 3782379 Registered Office: Birch Street
Wolverhampton WV1 4HY.

This message has been scanned for viruses by BlackSpider MailControl

http://www.blackspider.com/, however, Carillion does not accept any responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan or otherwise
check this e-mail and any attachments.

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation (12 December 2011)

Quote-marks http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Environmenta...

Download Warm Front scheme customer promise (PDF, 178K) [link]

Warm Front customer promise

We aim to give you the highest level of service through the Warm Front programme.

This customer promise sets out the standards of service that you can expect from us.

We want to make it easy for you to contact us, and to make sure that our products and services meet your needs.

If you feel that we are not meeting our high standards, please let us know.

Ross Armstrong
Operations Director

Our commitment to you

A personal service

We will:
• treat you with respect and understanding;
• listen carefully to understand your needs;
• be fair, helpful and easy to talk to; and
• provide a polite, warm and efficient service.

Getting it right for you

We will:
• keep our promises;
• provide accurate and consistent information;
• provide information that is easy to understand;
• explain clearly all you need to know and all you need to do; and
• aim to continually improve the quality of our service to you.

A quick and efficient service

We will:
• deal with your enquiry when you first contact us wherever possible; and
• treat your enquiry confidentially and sensitively.

Your opinion is important to us
We value your feedback and your comments help us to identify good practice and improve our level of service.

If, for any reason, you are unhappy with the service we have provided, please let us know how we can improve it.

You can contact one of Ross’s team in the
following ways.

Phone: 0800 316 6011
(Freephone: Monday to Friday, 8am to 6pm)
Minicom: 0800 072 0156
(Freephone: Monday to Friday, 8am to 6pm)
Fax: 0191 247 3801
E-mail: customer.management@carillionplc.com
Address: Carillion Energy Services
Customer Management Team
Freepost NEA 12054
Newcastle Upon Tyne
NE2 1BR

We will acknowledge your letter or e-mail within two working days of receiving it.

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation (12 December 2011)

Quote-marks http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/ab...

Warm Front

If you are a customer of the Warm Front Scheme and you have not already contacted Carillion Energy Services (formerly Eaga), the Scheme Manager, please do so on 0800 316 6011. This is a freephone number and lines are open from Monday to Friday, 8am to 6pm.

Alternatively, you can contact Carillion Energy Services by email: enquiry@carillionplc.com

Or by writing to:

Carillion Energy Services
Customer Management Team
Freepost NEA12054
Newcastle upon Tyne
NE2 1BR

If you have already complained to Carillion Energy Services and now wish to escalate your complaint to this Department, please write to us at DECC, using the address on the Contact us page.

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation (12 December 2011)

Quote-marks THANK YOU Andrew,
VERY clear and very helpful to all I hope!
Thank you again, I appreciate your time
Seasons Greetings
Dee

Link to this

Robert Scrivens left an annotation (18 February 2012)

Quote-marks Having experienced the result of a faulty boiler installation by a warm front appointed installer.That being the lack of the required service visits and insulation of the cold feed pipe which had frozen in the recent bad weather. I contacted them to complain about the bad workmanship they were completely oblivious to my complaint saying that as the installation of the boiler was in September 2009 it was out of guarantee. I tried to explain that when the installation took place in 2009 that was well within any guarantee period also the lack of the required service visits which should have identified the shortcomings of inadequate insulation was a breach of contract by the installer. I have yet to speak to a senior manager in the warm front scheme as the all seem to be in meetings for days on end. The only person I spoke to at Warm Front was a particularly unpleasant and unhelpful person called Peter. I think my next option is to contact the following DECC, Trading Standards & Health and Safety. Any other suggestions would be appreciated

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation (18 February 2012)

Quote-marks Try contacting these two people directly :-
ross.armstrong <ross.armstrong@carillionplc.com>; paul.varley <paul.varley@carillionplc.com>

No guarantees, but as Ross Armstrong claims to be the Central Services Director of Carillion Energy Services

(http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/ross-armstron...)

Public Company; 10,001+ employees; CLLN.L; Construction industry

April 2011 – Present (11 months) Newcastle upon Tyne, United Kingdom

Leading the provision of back office functions across Carillion Energy Services, totalling around 1,400 employees with a sector turnover of £400m. Key areas of responsibility include:

* All contact centre operations, spread across four major UK sites
* All work planning and scheduling, together with sub-contractor management across our heating, renewables, breakdown and repair and insulation businesses
* Full delivery of customer service across the business, managing with all reactive and proactive elements of service delivery
* An ongoing programme of business change and improvement, managing activity in partnership with business leads to drive efficiencies and best practice throughout the organisation
* Mobilisation of new contracts into the CES business
* Relationship management at the highest level with key CES customers, including the Department of Energy and Climate Change (DECC), the BBC and the Legal Services Commission

and Mr Varley is the Managing Director of Carillion Energy Services Limited they should both take note (hopefully).

Mr Varley has previously made some interesting statements to Ministers in respect to complaints, and the Warm Front Scheme, so it will be interesting to see his response (if any)!

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation (18 February 2012)

Quote-marks Thank you Robert and Andrew for your recent annotations. Robert I am so sorry to hear of your angst with Warmfront and like you I had no insulation put on condense pipe...(I later found out that a soakaway should have been installed....one with limestone crystals to deal with the acidic condense water) Thanks to Corgi, this has now been done but not sure if Gas Safe (post Corgi) also send specialists to check safety!

The condense pipe (6m 'fixed' along outside wall, attached to downpipe with no fall) drew in rainwater and flooded my whole downstairs area.......this happened when I was away looking after elderly parents. It entailed a new kitchen and wooden floor which thankfully I was insured for. This took me over a year to sort out but upside was the info I gave my insurance company on Warmfront installers has resulted in a successful cross claim and a refund of my excess......but I could have certainly done without the hassle!

The saying goes" we all may want to live on the mountain top but all the learning takes place in the climb!"
So do whatever is necessary to sort this and thank you Andrew for your very helpful information on who may be accountable at Warmfront/Carillion.
Good Luck, watch this space as they say!

Link to this

Robert Scrivens left an annotation (18 February 2012)

Quote-marks Thanks for your help guys much appreciated. I shall try them again on Monday the installation company was SunRealm in Luton who were of no help whatsoever quite the opposite in fact, their supervisor visited on Monday last he was asked if the system had been fitted with a frost free cable on the cold inlet pipe would the pipe have frozen. He said no but it's not their custom to fit them, we then asked him if the cold inlet was properly lagged with wide foam insulation he said he didn't know and it's not their custom to lag interior pipes. They did however remove the lagging from the previous boiler which had survived 7 years with the cold inlet properly lagged. His name was Jim and his surname rhymed with Dope and he promised to send us the part number required for the local guy to fit still waiting and he has stopped answering his phone. So I have had my 2 young grandchildren and my handicapped son without hot water or proper heating for the last 9 days now. sighhh

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation (18 February 2012)

Quote-marks Sigh indeed Robert......Info given by Andrew seems a good bet and looking back on trail.....Andrew has kindly helped before.

The heating contractors, are they registered members of Gas Safe (formally Corgi)...am sure if they are Gas Safe will be interested in hearing about them. If same rules as Corgi still apply then no registration effectively means no work!

Take care
Dee

Link to this

Robert Scrivens left an annotation (19 February 2012)

Quote-marks Yes Sun Realm are a large company based in Luton I have provisionally contacted gas safe to ensure the fitter who installed the new boiler was registered to work on LPG boilers they said he was. The strange thing is he said at the time he had never fitted an LPG boiler before. I have also asked gas safe who I should contact to progress a complaint regarding Warm Fronts refusal to appoint a customer manager to progress my complaint, the lady I spoke to didn't know. What I really need is a copy of the terms and conditions that Warm Front have with their appointed fitters.

Thank you for the info Andrew I have tried emailing them 5 times so far without a single reply, I shall try to forward those to the 2 you have suggested

Link to this

Robert Scrivens left an annotation (19 February 2012)

Quote-marks http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/moneytaxandb...

All customers that receive a new or replacement gas heating system will also get an aftercare service that includes an annual service visit.

Link to this

Andrew Chapman left an annotation (19 February 2012)

Quote-marks Gernerally, there is a problem with the condensate, in external condensate drains, from Condensing Boilers freezing in very cold weather.

There was a feature on TV recently of someone who had experienced problems with a new Condensing Boiler installed by British Gas, with the condenstae drain freezing.

British Gas, as standard, now install an electrical heater to the condensate pipe, if it is position outside the property. They have only just realised that if they install the condensate pipe inside the building then there is not such a potential problem with freezing. Any external pipework, with water in it can freeze, in cold weather, so the length of the pipework just increases the risk.

In respect to disposing of the condensate, the condensate is in fact CONTAMINATED water, and as such is best disposed of to the foul drain of the property.

This practice was being carried out 25 years ago with the condensate from commercial air conditioning systems!

Keep perservering with the Warm Front administrators, I will, as the scheme is due to finish in October 2012 !!

Link to this

D. Speers left an annotation (19 February 2012)

Quote-marks Keep on keeping on chaps......they will not know whats hit them!
Dee

Link to this

Jan Cox left an annotation (17 April 2012)

Quote-marks The following is a copy of the letter of complaint I sent to Chris Hargreaves
Iguana Services Limited
Eaga House
Archbold Terrace
Newcastle Upon Tyne
NE2 1DB
27th May 2008

Dear Mr Hargreaves,

Supply of Goods & Services Act 1982 (As amended) Common Law Scotland.

I am writing to you concerning a spillage of chemical cleaning fluid on my hall carpet by your installer Ian Smith on Tuesday 20th May 2008, whilst installing a boiler for the sum of £3,134.27 (£2,700 government grant and £485.98 my contribution). Mr Smith mentioned the spill on completion of the work, stating it was only water and would dry eventually. The following morning Wednesday 21st May 2008 I awoke with a banging headache, and one of my daughters shouting on the stairs about a terrible smell. The smell came from the wet carpet in the downstairs hallway, in the form of what I can only describe as vile smelling fumes which stung my eyes. The ‘spillage’ covered the whole area of the carpet, approximately 5foot x 10foot.

The Supply of Goods & Services Act 1982 (as amended) states that the work should be carried out with reasonable care and skill.

As I was waiting in for the electrician to arrive and complete the job I thought he could witness the smell and report back to your company, as Mr Smith said the electrician usually completed the job the next day. I rang Iguana to check when he was arriving and was told it was up to 48 hours. I thought that by the next day the fumes would have dissipated but they had not, even with the window at the top of the stairs left open. I rang Iguana again on Thursday 22nd May in the morning to report the smell and stains on the carpet and was told by a telephone operative to spray it with some disinfectant, which I did, but which had no effect whatsoever.

I would have been happy if someone from your company could have just arranged a visit or sent someone to clean the carpet as it is a health hazard, but now the carpet will have to be replaced. I have since found other problems which are listed below.

On Thursday I was promised that you would ring me back possibly in the afternoon as you were busy. I did not receive a phone call that day.

I rang Trading standards that day and was advised to send you a letter, but the damage has already been done. I have also been in touch with Environmental health, a representative from there rang you on Friday 23rd May on my behalf but was told you were in a meeting as I was told earlier that day. Again I was promised a phone call from you and did not receive it.

There is a broken floor board under the landing carpet which was not in that condition before he started work.

There are burns on the merchants’ chest in the hall where he has soldered a metal pipe, connecting to a radiator.

Please respond to my complaint and replace my carpet, repair the merchants’ chest, & make good the floorboard, within the next 14 days. If you fail to remedy in this time I will have no option but to consider taking the matter further.

I am very disappointed with the apparent general lack of concern over this matter, and it is now too late to do anything about the fumes from the carpet which should have been dealt with on Wednesday to avoid any further problems for myself and 3 daughters.

In general Mr Smith showed a lack of respect for my property and the occupants. My 14 year old daughter found him about to use the toilet with the door wide open, and he barged into the bedrooms of both my 16 year old and 14 year old without first knocking or checking with me.

He left the power flush hose to empty on my lawn, which was 12inches away from the main drain he could have used, and the grass has died in that spot.

He emptied a load of polystyrene pieces straight into a wheelie bin which should have been bagged up first as the refuse collectors only accept refuse bags.

He was in a rush to leave on Tuesday and I signed a form without actually checking everything first as I was under duress and wanted Mr Smith to leave my premises as soon as possible.

As a single mother in an all female household I found his presence uncomfortable, and felt that he took advantage of the absence of a man in the house.

Yours Sincerely

J. M. Cox (MRS)

I received no response to this letter and numerous e-mails till the 13th June when I had an e-mail requesting my address!So how did the installer manage to find me? They managed to write to me requesting the payment! I received an acknowledgment of my complaint dated 18th June. Carpets were cleaned on 30th June and they sent a cheque for £50 an 'ex gratia' payment in full and final settlement of all claims arising out of this dispute'. The boiler (ideal he24 isar) died on Thursday 5th April this year 2012 and is unrepairable. A local plumber is replacing it, so at long last I can have a decent hot water system. My last boiler was a baxi and pegged out after 20 plus years of service. I would strongly advise anyone needing a new boiler to borrow the money and get it done privately. Will be cheaper and less hassle in the long run.

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D. Speers left an annotation (17 April 2012)

Quote-marks Dear oh dear what a litany of avoidable disasters. I have to say accepting £50 in full and final settlement was very spirited of you but I can fully understand that you just wanted to see light at end of tunnel...and not another b..... mirror
I have to agree with you and support your advice on going private.You dont say if there was a follow up appointment to check work installation but maybe by time Eaga handed over to Carillion this had stopped! Not that the check up was that thorough....like you I had sawn through floorboards, left unfixed and panel pins left sticking out where wall panel for access to pipes, was removed. But the flood of downstairs was the the biggest headache to sort and took over a year!
Thank you for posting this and all best wishes for new boiler. I'm keeping fingers crossed and saving madly!

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Jan Cox left an annotation (17 April 2012)

Quote-marks Thank you Dee for your kind comments. New boiler is installed I have hot water almost straight away instead of having to wait 5 mins for it to come through,and reducing the flow to keep the water hot. Radiators are at last hot to touch not luke warm. Best of all no clanging of pipes making my house sound like 'a haunted house'. Compared to some of the horror stories I've been reading I got off lightly. Hope you get your heating sorted, it's a weight off my mind getting rid of that cheap nasty thing in my bathroom that tried to pass itself off as a boiler!

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chistine chapman left an annotation ( 2 December 2012)

Quote-marks I have had a nine month battle with warm front and carillon energy services and think I must now give up.
Their installer for draught proofing simply walked out saying we don't do houses for health and safety reasons, their customer services said we'll send an inspector for another installer in 11 days but if its dangerous we cant help you further, DECC said rubbish of course they do houses. Now I have windows with huge gaps in them awaiting the draught proofing seals and its freezing.
I wish i had never heard of warm front its seems to be an expensive con for the taxpayer and positively dangerous for those of us with severe disabilities.

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D. Speers left an annotation ( 3 December 2012)

Quote-marks So sorry to hear of your difficulties Christine.Its a real challenge trying to deal with obvious injustices!
I wish you well and wish I could help more but magic wands out of stock! Try to get MP on board and WW.theyworkforyou.com may help you identify line of accountability.

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Steve Winder left an annotation (14 January 2013)

Quote-marks Hi All,
Just had a call from one of Jamie's colleagues, & as expected ---no resolution? Well, from their side it has been resolved?
In a nutshell, I had this ideal isar boiler installed under the warmfront scheme as both myself & wife are disabled. Both of us suffer from conditions that require heat.
In the first year of it's installation we had called out engineers 13 times? On the Penultimate visit the engineer wrote down his Recommendation to have the thing "Condemned" However, I have just been told the report cannot be found?
Last August the Boiler broke down again! It was just out of it's 2 year so called Guarantee?
We had to get a private engineer out who told us the Pressure Tank had gone? To replace it would involve taking the boiler off the wall, & (in his Words:- I've done this before with Ideal & after replacing & rehanging the boiler, the leaks that arise from this are non ending, it would better & cheaper in the long run to replace it)?
After contacting Carillion, & telling this, plus the fact we were both in acute pain from having no heat or hot water, they started a "review"!
A fortnight later, I took the decision to have a new Worcester Installed @ a cost of £1500.00p Shortly after Carillion phoned & told me "because the boiler is out of Guarantee, there is nothing we can do"? "Would you like to apply for another Grant"?
At this I told him where to go.
Most Utility companies i.e. Water gas offer the customer a stand by, as a supply of Bottled Water, of a Room heater? As most of Carillion's customers are mainly Disabled, surely they should do the same?
Nothing! once again NOTHING!
I was told today that NO Compensation would be forthcoming as they cannot find an engineers report? Great! so I suppose that is my fault as well? also a report from DECC has gone missing? Again ---my Fault! ---NOT!
So Jamie, thanks for your inquisitiveness but I think I was right in being "Suspicious" from the beginning? Is this just an exercise in showing you have responded to claimants complaints, but, without a satisfactory conclusion for ALL not just the multi million pound company you work for?

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D. Speers left an annotation (14 January 2013)

Quote-marks I am sorry to read of your situation Steve....yes seems to be a PR exercise doesn't it! If DECC had a complaints page on their website, I would happily copy this trail to them!
In fact I believe every Gov dept should publish complainants and leave room for comments too. Will set up a petition and give link here....what else can we do?

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Steve Winder left an annotation (14 January 2013)

Quote-marks Just after posting, things (from Memory)are coming back from when I was having all this nonsense. My understanding is this:-,
I was going to take Carillion to Court. In fact I had Instructed my Solicitor to do so. The one Mistake my Solicitor made was of not telling me to keep the scrap iron called an Ideal Isar as evidence? Without thinking I allowed the fitters to discard it?
However, following my conversation with your Rep. Jamie, he tells me there's nothing you can do without the evidence? I disagree!
MY Solicitor told me we would be taking your company to Court
1/ as the Boiler was not Fit for Purpose!
2/ Warmfront/Carillion have a Duty of Care for 8 years after the Installation!
SO, all this "we cannot do anything" is rubbish! you mean you will NOT do anything? there is a difference!
Why I expected a different outcome I don't know?

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D. Speers left an annotation (14 January 2013)

Quote-marks Just for general info....All who contribute to annotations cannot do anything but give info which may possibly help. If possible always include your MP...because if enough get flack they may wake up and do something! Write to MP at www.writetothem.com....to find out who MP is www.theyworkforyou.com and to ask Freedom of Information question try www.whatdotheyknow.com.
Good luck and keep posting please.

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