Pre-payment for software

The request was refused by Brent Borough Council.

Dear Brent Borough Council,

In the following FOI response you state that the council paid £40k, in advance, for software which has not yet been delivered – more than 18 months after you (we) paid for it :

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/mo...

The rationale appears to be that the council would be getting a discount by purchasing this software in advance of it actually being written.

However, in the following FOI response, Oxfordshire County Council state that they only paid £25k for the same software :

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/mo...

This perturbs me. As a taxpayer, I am deeply concerned by the concept of a council paying so far in advance for a piece of software. How do we know if it will be any good? What happens if the company goes bust in the interim? How do we know what the true market value of the software will be? This is a particularly relevant question, given that the market value as assessed by Oxfordshire County Council was only £25k – 40% less than you paid for the same software.

Q1 : Please provide copies of all council documents which discussed this decision. I assume that there was an approvals process of some sort

Q2 : Please list the benefits, functionality or other rationale for spending £40k on this software. Again, I assume that there are committee papers or similar documents which outline the expected benefits

Q3 : Will the implementation of the Mosaic module require additional expenditure? For example, will the council need to buy new servers, new operating system software or commission implementation services or training? Please provide any documentation which relates to future budget implications associated with the Mosaic module.

Yours faithfully,

Charles Drew

Dear Brent Borough Council,

This request is past the legal due date, which is really disappointing. Please explain why this has happened, and respond without further delay.

Yours faithfully,

Charles Drew

FOI, Brent Borough Council

Dear Mr Drew

We are sorry for the delay in answering your request.

I have asked the relvant departments to respond to your request as soon as possible.

Quite separately we will initiate an Internal Review into why no response has been sent to date.

The timetable for responding to Internal Reviews is 20 working days from complaint, although this can be extended to 40 wd where the issues are complex. Where practicable the review will be undertaken by a senior manager who has not involved in handling the request.

Regards

Stephen Williams

for Brent ITU

349-357 High Road
Wembley
Middlesex
HA9 6BZ

020 8937 1426

show quoted sections

Veni Kotak, Brent Borough Council

Brent Council - INFORMATION REQUEST

Our Reference: 1272223
====================================================

Dear Sir/Madam

I acknowledge your request for further information received on 20 October
2012.

In summary, you have asked three questions relating to the council's
response to your original request for information regarding Mosaic
software. Before the council is in a position to respond to your
questions, could you please confirm that you are referring to the
Corelogic Mosaic Software, which was previously known as Frameworki rather
than the GIS Mosaic product, which the council uses and recently
purchased?

The 20 working day timetable for responding to your request is halted
whilst we await the further details requested. If these are not received
within 60 days of this letter the request will be closed.

Yours faithfully

Veni Kotak
[1][email address]
 

--
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and other lawful purposes.

References

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Dear Veni Kotak,

I am referring to Corelogic's Mosaic software, which supplements or complements or replaces Frameworki (I don't know which).

To be frank, I thought this was pretty obvious from the original request, and I am very disappointed that the Council has requested clarification AFTER the legal due date for a response had passed. You say that the clock has stopped while you wait for my response, but in fact you were already overdue before you asked for clarification.

Yours sincerely,

Charles Drew

Kotak, Veni, Brent Borough Council

I will be out of the office from 21 November 2012 and will not return
until 11 December 2012. Please contact Raj Seedher -
[email address] in my absence otherwise I will respond to your
email upon my return.

Regards

 

Veni Kotak

 

Dear Brent Borough Council,

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.

I am writing to request an internal review of Brent Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Pre-payment for software'.

This response is significantly overdue. Please respond without further delay.

A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address:
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/pr...

Yours faithfully,

Charles Drew

FOI, Brent Borough Council

Dear Mr Drew

We are sorry for the delay in answering your request. I have asked the relvant departments to respond to your request as soon as possible.

Quite separately we will initiate an Internal Review into why no response has been sent to date. The timetable for responding to Internal Reviews is 20 working days from complaint, although this can be extended to 40 wd where the issues are complex. Where practicable the review will be undertaken by a senior manager who has not involved in handling the request.

Regards

Stephen Williams

for Brent ITU

349-357 High Road
Wembley
Middlesex
HA9 6BZ

020 8937 1426

show quoted sections

Veni Kotak, Brent Borough Council

Brent Council - INFORMATION REQUEST

Our Reference: 1272223
====================================================

Dear Sir/Madam

Further to your request for information received on 20 October 2012 I am
writing to inform you that unfortunately the information you requested
cannot be supplied as it is not held by Brent Council.

If you are dissatisfied with the response or how the Council has handled
your request you can complain to the Council by writing to the following
address: IT Standards Manager at Brent Civic Centre, Floor 7, Engineers
Way, Wembley HA9 0FJ.  Telephone 020 8937 1402   e-mail
[1][Brent Borough Council request email]
. It is the Council’s policy to ensure that, where practicable, your
complaint is dealt with by someone who was not involved in the original
decision.  You also have a right of appeal about our decision to the
Information Commissioner, however, the Information Commissioner will not
normally consider an appeal until you have exhausted your rights of
redress and complaint to the Council. The Information Commissioner can be
contacted as follows:
Information Commissioner's Office, Wycliffe House, Water Lane, Wilmslow,
Cheshire SK9 5AF. Telephone:   01625 545 700,
www.informationcommissioner.gov.uk
As part of our commitment to improve our service to our customers we would
welcome any feedback on the way that we have dealt with your request.

Yours faithfully

Veni Kotak

[email address]
 

--
The use of Brent Council's e-mail system may be monitored and
communications read in order to secure effective operation of the system
and other lawful purposes.

References

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Dear Brent Borough Council,

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.

I am writing to request an internal review of Brent Borough Council's handling of my FOI request 'Pre-payment for software'.

Many months ago I asked the following questions :

Q1 : Please provide copies of all council documents which discussed this decision. I assume that there was an approvals process of some sort

Q2 : Please list the benefits, functionality or other rationale for spending £40k on this software. Again, I assume that there are committee papers or similar documents which outline the expected benefits

Q3 : Will the implementation of the Mosaic module require additional expenditure? For example, will the council need to buy new servers, new operating system software or commission implementation services or training? Please provide any documentation which relates to future budget implications associated with the Mosaic module.

Following excessive delays - well outside legal limits - you have responded by saying that the council does not hold any of the requested information. It is not credible that a council would make a £40k investment without any record of the decision-making process or any record of the expected benefits from the investment. If you really don't have any such documentation then there is something seriously amiss with your decision-making.

A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/p...

Yours faithfully,

Charles Drew

FOI, Brent Borough Council

Dear Mr Drew

I have asked a senior manager to undertake the review you request.

The timetable for responding to Internal Reviews is 20 working days from complaint, although this can be extended to 40 wd where the issues are complex. Where practicable the review will be undertaken by a senior manager who has not involved in handling the request.

Regards

Stephen Williams

for Brent ITU

Brent Civic Centre
Engineers Way
Wembley HA9 0FJ

020 8937 1426

show quoted sections

Veni Kotak, Brent Borough Council

Brent Council - INFORMATION REQUEST

Our Reference: 1272223
====================================================

Dear Mr Drew,

You have requested an internal review as detailed below.

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information
reviews.

 

I am writing to request an internal review of Brent Borough Council's
handling of my FOI request 'Pre-payment for software'.

 

Many months ago I asked the following questions :

 

Q1 : Please provide copies of all council documents which discussed this
decision. I assume that there was an approvals process of some sort

 

Q2 : Please list the benefits, functionality or other rationale for
spending £40k on this software. Again, I assume that there are committee
papers or similar documents which outline the expected benefits

 

Q3 : Will the implementation of the Mosaic module require additional
expenditure? For example, will the council need to buy new servers, new
operating system software or commission implementation services or
training? Please provide any documentation which relates to future budget
implications associated with the Mosaic module.

 

Following excessive delays - well outside legal limits - you have
responded by saying that the council does not hold any of the requested
information. It is not credible that a council would make a £40k
investment without any record of the decision-making process or any record
of the expected benefits from the investment. If you really don't have any
such documentation then there is something seriously amiss with your
decision-making.

I have queried the request with the area responsible for making the
investment. I am satisfied that the council does not hold the information
that your requested.

There was a decision making process by a lead person involing,
procurement, legal and the sevice director. The investment on MOSIAC was
wrapped up in the renewal of the Frameworki renewal contract. 
Effectively, the £40k does not appear as a cost line but via negotiation
was included in the overall price of the renewal.

The renewal contract itself is deemed as commercially sensitive and would
not be disclosed under Section 43 of the Freedom of Information Act 2000.
Information contained in the contract has been assessed as likely
to prejudice the commercial interests of the supplier if it was disclosed.

If you are not content with the outcome of the internal review, you have
the right to appeal directly to the Information Commissioner for a
decision. The Information Commissioner can be contacted as follows:

Information Commissioner's Office, Wycliffe House, Water Lane, Wilmslow,
Cheshire SK9 5AF; Telephone: 01625 545 700, [1]www.ico.gov.uk

As part of our commitment to improve our service to our customers we would
welcome any feedback on the way that we have dealt with your request.

Yours faithfully,
Raj Seedher
[2][email address]

 

--
The use of Brent Council's e-mail system may be monitored and
communications read in order to secure effective operation of the system
and other lawful purposes.

References

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1. http://www.ico.gov.uk/
2. mailto:[email address]