List of Geographical coordinates in Welsh
Dear Cadw: Scheduled Ancient Monuments,
I would like the most recent list of the above in Welsh.
Please also include Geographical coordinates (X,Y) as well as OS.
Diolch yn fawr
Yours faithfully,
Llywelyn Llwyd
Dear Cadw: Welsh Historic Monuments,
This request should have been titled:
List of all Historic Monuments in Wales, in Welsh.
Please supply as an Excel file.
Yours faithfully,
Llywelyn
Dear Llywelin
Thank you for your recent enquiry concerning a list of Historic Monuments in Wales. This information is publically available, therefore Cadw will not treat this enquiry as a Freedom of Information request.
Cadw can supply a list of Scheduled Ancient Monuments in Wales in an Excel format. At present this information is only available in English, will this suitable for your needs.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Yours sincereley
Vince Devine
Rheolwr Gwybodaeth a Hybysrwydd/Knowledge & Information Manager
Ymgysylltu a'r Cyhoedd a Llywodraethu/Public Engagement & Governance
Cadw
Llywoderaeth Cymru/Welsh Government
Plas Carew
5/7 Cefn Coed
Parc Nantgarw
Caerdydd/Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Ffôn / Tel: 01443 33 6122
Ffacs / Fax: 01443 33 60 01
E-bost:[email address]
E-mail:[email address]
Dilynwch Cadw / Follow Cadw:
www.cadw.cymru.gov.uk | www.cadw.wales.gov.uk
www.facebook.com/pages/Cadw/254566024556... | www.mobile.twitter.com/cadwwales | http://mobile.twitter.com/cadwcymru
www.youtube.com/user/cadwwales | www.flickr.com/photos/cadwwales
P Helpwch yr amgylchedd - peidiwch ag argraffu hon os nad oes gwir raid. Help our environment - only print this if really necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Devine, Vincent (DH - CADW),
Thanks for your quick reply.
1. My request is for the information be released in WELSH; not doing so contravenes the Welsh Government guidelines: please confirm with the Welsh Language Board.
2. I requested the information to include Geographical coordinates (X,Y) as well as OS.
3. My request is for the MOST RECENT file. The Excel Database you released in the past is (very) out of date - and full of mistakes.
Diolch yn fawr.
Yours sincerely,
Llywelyn
Dear Llywelyn
I will check regarding the Welsh/English versions, however, at present we only hold a version of the data in the English language. The XY coordinates are included. We would always supply the latest version of the data. I would be grateful if you would provide some examples of any mistakes that you have found and confirm that we are discussing the dataset concerning Scheduled Ancient Monuments (these are legally protected archaeological sites and monuments). There should be approximately 4000 records in this dataset.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Yours sincerely
Vince Devine
Rheolwr Gwybodaeth a Hybysrwydd/Knowledge & Information Manager
Ymgysylltu a'r Cyhoedd a Llywodraethu/Public Engagement & Governance
Cadw
Llywoderaeth Cymru/Welsh Government
Plas Carew
5/7 Cefn Coed
Parc Nantgarw
Caerdydd/Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Ffôn / Tel: 01443 33 6122
Ffacs / Fax: 01443 33 60 01
E-bost:[email address]
E-mail:[email address]
Dilynwch Cadw / Follow Cadw:
www.cadw.cymru.gov.uk | www.cadw.wales.gov.uk
www.facebook.com/pages/Cadw/254566024556... | www.mobile.twitter.com/cadwwales | http://mobile.twitter.com/cadwcymru
www.youtube.com/user/cadwwales | www.flickr.com/photos/cadwwales
P Helpwch yr amgylchedd - peidiwch ag argraffu hon os nad oes gwir raid. Help our environment - only print this if really necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Devine, Vincent (DH - CADW),
1. Language: I await your response.
2. You're incorrect. The data provided by you on a FoI request dated 1 August 2009 by Susan Davies had X/Y OS coordinates ONLY in two parts; NOT geographical. The heading of both columns tell you that they are NGR_X and NGR_Y - which stand for National Grid Reference (ie Ordnance Survey!) NOT geographical coordinates, which is my request, and is the global standard.
3. The last database you have made public is the (above) August 2009. Please confirm this. In your letter dated 6 August 2009 to Susan, you said:
"We are currently developing a new database, that will be used to create and manage our Scheduled Ancient Monuments data. It is envisaged that the database will contain a quality assured dataset and a sophisticated querying and export functionality, providing Cadw with the ability to provide extensive digital data to all our customers."
Has this been done?
I can also confirm that my request is for the dataset concerning Scheduled Ancient Monuments.
Yours sincerely,
Llywelyn
Dear Llwelyn
Thank you for the updated information. I recall the earlier request for the information. Originally the request was submitted as a Freedom of Information enquiry, but again as the information is publically available upon request, we agreed that the Freedom of Information process was unnecessary.
You have mentioned geographical coordinates, I suspect you are referring to Longitude and Latitude. Cadw use the traditional National Grid Reference which is alpha numeric e.g. SH2345037700 and a system used within a Geographic Information System, which replaces the letters with numbers (NGR X and NGR Y) in our records. We use this system, as part of the designation process is to produce an annotated Ordnance Survey map. There are no plans to record to Longitude and Latitude, however, you could convert the National Grid References as required.
The database project is a 6 year project, the initial phase was to capture high level requirements. Another more detailed requirements gathering exercise is planned for Phase 5.
I hope that the above answers your queries.
Yours sincerely
Vince Devine
Rheolwr Gwybodaeth a Hybysrwydd/Knowledge & Information Manager
Ymgysylltu a'r Cyhoedd a Llywodraethu/Public Engagement & Governance
Cadw
Llywoderaeth Cymru/Welsh Government
Plas Carew
5/7 Cefn Coed
Parc Nantgarw
Caerdydd/Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Ffôn / Tel: 01443 33 6122
Ffacs / Fax: 01443 33 60 01
E-bost:[email address]
E-mail:[email address]
Dilynwch Cadw / Follow Cadw:
www.cadw.cymru.gov.uk | www.cadw.wales.gov.uk
www.facebook.com/pages/Cadw/254566024556... | www.mobile.twitter.com/cadwwales | http://mobile.twitter.com/cadwcymru
www.youtube.com/user/cadwwales | www.flickr.com/photos/cadwwales
P Helpwch yr amgylchedd - peidiwch ag argraffu hon os nad oes gwir raid. Help our environment - only print this if really necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Devine, Vincent (DH - CADW),
1. Language: still awaiting your response.
2. So at last, you understand that the data you use is OS, not geo. You also confirm that you do not hold the geographical coordinates/ Whaw!
3. I asked you to confirm when did CADW last release a list / a database of information on Scheduled Ancient Monuments. I still await a date. Secondly, you inform me that what you said on 1 August 2009 to Susan Davies has now changed and that "database project is a 6 year project, the initial phase was to capture high level requirements. Another more detailed requirements gathering exercise is planned for Phase 5. " So, where are you now on that 6-year timescale?
Lastly, you ask, "I would be grateful if you would provide some examples of any mistakes that you have found". As my list would take me over a week to comply, I shall give you one example only: the database has a village / town / UA called "Llanidloes Without"!!!
Yours sincerely,
Llywelyn
Dear Devine, Vincent (DH - CADW),
I dont need an "internal review" from whatdotheyknow.com; I hit the wrong button!
I would prefer a response from CADW.
Yours sincerely,
Llywelyn
Dear Llwelyn
Thank you for your latest e-mail. To answer some of your outstanding queries.
1: Still awaiting a decision
3: Cadw does not have a vehicle for the mass release of this data, but it is available upon request.
4: Year 1
5: The data that was originally supplied included column headings, however, I do not know whether they are still included in the dataset that you are viewing. 'Llanidloes Without' is not a mistake, but the name of the Community that the Scheduled Ancient Monument is located within. A Community (similar to a parish in England)is the smallest administrative unit in Wales. Geographical datasats that cover Wales generally include both the Unitary Authority name and the Community name.
Yours sincerely
Vince Devine
Rheolwr Gwybodaeth a Hybysrwydd/Knowledge & Information Manager
Ymgysylltu a'r Cyhoedd a Llywodraethu/Public Engagement & Governance
Cadw
Llywoderaeth Cymru/Welsh Government
Plas Carew
5/7 Cefn Coed
Parc Nantgarw
Caerdydd/Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Ffôn / Tel: 01443 33 6122
Ffacs / Fax: 01443 33 60 01
E-bost:[email address]
E-mail:[email address]
Dilynwch Cadw / Follow Cadw:
www.cadw.cymru.gov.uk | www.cadw.wales.gov.uk
www.facebook.com/pages/Cadw/254566024556... | www.mobile.twitter.com/cadwwales | http://mobile.twitter.com/cadwcymru
www.youtube.com/user/cadwwales | www.flickr.com/photos/cadwwales
P Helpwch yr amgylchedd - peidiwch ag argraffu hon os nad oes gwir raid. Help our environment - only print this if really necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Devine, Vincent (DH - CADW),
1. Awaiting
3a. I asked you to confirm when did CADW last released a list / a database of information on Scheduled Ancient Monuments. I still await a date.
3b I request those coordinates now, included in the database.
4. So you've done nothing in the last two years?
5. Thanks for the information on comunities and Unitary Authority; which I already knew! In which community is "Llanidloes without"? Should it have a capital "W"?
Please also note my name. in your first email to me you called me "Llywelin" and in the last you called me "Llwelyn"!!!
Yours sincerely,
Llywelyn
Dear Llywelyn
Thank you for your reply. To answer some of your queries: -
3a. The database is updated on a fairly frequent basis as new monuments are Scheduled. As I have already explained, it is not published but is available on demand.
3b. Cadw capture the data using National Grid References and the data is derived from our Geographic Information System. The data is supplied with NGRs, we do not capture Longitude and Latitude or supply it in this format, however, as I have already explained you could convert if required.
4. Database development requires investigation and planning, which has been and is currently being undertaken.
5. I will include checking the data for upper and lower case anomalies in the section's long term work plan, however, I cannot provide any timescales for this work.
I hope that the above answers your queries.
Yours sincerely
Vince Devine
Rheolwr Gwybodaeth a Hybysrwydd/Knowledge & Information Manager
Ymgysylltu a'r Cyhoedd a Llywodraethu/Public Engagement & Governance
Cadw
Llywoderaeth Cymru/Welsh Government
Plas Carew
5/7 Cefn Coed
Parc Nantgarw
Caerdydd/Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Ffôn / Tel: 01443 33 6122
Ffacs / Fax: 01443 33 60 01
E-bost:[email address]
E-mail:[email address]
Dilynwch Cadw / Follow Cadw:
www.cadw.cymru.gov.uk | www.cadw.wales.gov.uk
www.facebook.com/pages/Cadw/254566024556... | www.mobile.twitter.com/cadwwales | http://mobile.twitter.com/cadwcymru
www.youtube.com/user/cadwwales | www.flickr.com/photos/cadwwales
P Helpwch yr amgylchedd - peidiwch ag argraffu hon os nad oes gwir raid. Help our environment - only print this if really necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Devine, Vincent (DH - CADW),
Diolch am dy lythyr.
1. I still await the most recent database in Welsh.
3a I still await a date the database was last released as part of a FoIR.
3b I note that you are refusing to supply me with geographical coordinates (Lat / Long)
4. I note that for the last two years you didn't do what you promised.
5. Upper / lower case mistakes was just that one example I gave you; your database contains hundreds of mistakes! And where is Llanidloes Without? There is no such place! You say it's a community. Where? I say it's a mistake; one of many.
I'm very, very surprised and disappointed by your very unhelpful approach.
Yours sincerely,
Llywelyn
Dear Llywelyn
Thank you for your recent request for Welsh Language Scheduled Ancient Monument information. I have sought the advice of the Welsh Government's Welsh Language Policy Unit who confirmed that internal documents are not required to be bilingual as they do not fall under the scope of the Welsh Government's Welsh Language Scheme.
The information you have requested is derived from an internal Geographic Information System (GIS) and is a component of a polygon depiction of a Scheduled Ancient monument called a 'Shapefile'. The information in the form of a MS Excel spreadsheet is considered to be an internal document and is therefore only available in English. Cadw supply this information upon request (it has never been published in this format) and we are happy to supply this data to you, and in the language in which it is currently available.
As explained on a number of previous e-mails, we are not refusing to supply you with Longitude and Latitude data, we simply do not have this information to give you.
I have checked the dataset and as far as I can see the information is in the correct title case. In an earlier e-mail I provided an explanation of what a Community area is and that Llanidloes Without is the name of the community area and not necessarily the settlement(s) that it contains. If you wish to find more information regarding Communities in Wales, you could consult Wikipedia and use the search term 'List of Communities in Wales'. In the Wikipedia list you will find that Llanidloes Without lies within the Unitary Authority of Powys.
If you wish to receive that dataset (as described above), I will be happy to despatch it to you.
Yours sincerely
Vince Devine
Rheolwr Gwybodaeth a Hybysrwydd/Knowledge & Information Manager
Ymgysylltu a'r Cyhoedd a Llywodraethu/Public Engagement & Governance
Cadw
Llywoderaeth Cymru/Welsh Government
Plas Carew
5/7 Cefn Coed
Parc Nantgarw
Caerdydd/Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Ffôn / Tel: 01443 33 6122
Ffacs / Fax: 01443 33 60 01
E-bost:[email address]
E-mail:[email address]
Dilynwch Cadw / Follow Cadw:
www.cadw.cymru.gov.uk | www.cadw.wales.gov.uk
www.facebook.com/pages/Cadw/254566024556... | www.mobile.twitter.com/cadwwales | http://mobile.twitter.com/cadwcymru
www.youtube.com/user/cadwwales | www.flickr.com/photos/cadwwales
P Helpwch yr amgylchedd - peidiwch ag argraffu hon os nad oes gwir raid. Help our environment - only print this if really necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We work to defend the right to FOI for everyone
Help us protect your right to hold public authorities to account. Donate and support our work.
Donate Now