Education and support for children with autism in Stockport

Perhaps deadlines would be met if Stockport Council required its staff to stay at work until a normal time and to work on Fridays? Just a suggestion.

I'm getting quite sick of SMBC failing to meet deadlines when I request things/ complain, but as I work, I can't ring to ask about it until 4/4.30...of course, everyone's gone by then!

Dear R Holt

Apart from all their Freedom of Information abuses, human rights abuses, financial irregularities of millions of pounds and planning abuses, this Council does terrible things to autistic children and their parents.

If you would like to contact me via this site, then I could put you in touch with many other parents of autistic children who are having terrible problems with Stockport Council.

Someone even had their autistic child taken into care against their will, apparently on grounds of cost.

Re the fact above that Lisburne Special School has 17 pupils who have Autism Spectrum Disorders.

Can I ask if they all receive their 'education' whilst shut in the school store cupboard, as certainly happened in 2007, as was proudly explained by the Head Teacher, Deborah Woods?

She felt that a child with autism, was properly educated if shut into the school store cupboard with a totally unqualified classroom assistant, who would stop the child from disturbing the other pupils.

It must be pointed out that she also took serious exception to the parent immediately requesting a complete re-assessment of the child's needs, stating that he 'had no right to ask for such a reassessment'. (that was legally wrong!)

She had also been in charge of that same child's education for 5 years, whilst never requesting any change in that child's SEN Statement, and being fully aware that the speech and language part of that SEN Statement was being completely overruled.

She must have been aware - as a teacher (and a Head Teacher at that)- that without such Speech and Language Therapy, that child was rendered incapable of uptaking any formal education, and yet she was prepared to watch as he failed and failed, and grew frustrated by his lack of ability to communicate. (At that point of course, he was shut into the store cupboard, to prevent his disruption of the other children's lessons).

As the school SENCO she was also fully aware that no speech and language therapist had ever worked with the child, whilst he was at her shcool. Yet his SEN Statement had made such claims that he would be helped.

Also she knew that this child had not been seen by any Educational Psychologist since his original Statement was made in 2001. And that no other professional (ie social worker, paediatrician)

School Reports very painfully show that the child fared worse when he left that school in 2007, than he had at his specialist nursery, which he left in 2002.

And that is what Lisburne Special School did for one disabled child, who should have been helped, and who had the legal right to expect help - and who had the legal duty to attend shcool for education.

I believe that this woman, who is currently bewailing the fact that her builders of her nice new 'autism unit' have gone bust. A good thing too! No child should suffer such a regime in the 21st Century.

In 2006, OFSTED (rubbish as it is) stated that Lisburne School could not cope with children with Autism and complex difficulties. Look it up on the OFSTED site. See the OFSTED Report 'letter to the children'. Yet in 2007, this woman was still trying to deny such children the chance of an education.

That is what happens in Stockport MBC. And in spite of being fully informed of that terrible treatment of a disabled and Statemented child, no-one at Stockport MBC will do anything about such rotten treatment.

It is disgraceful!

Andrew Webb is in overall charge of this rotten treatment. He is the'accountable person'.

Is the latest 'Claire Naven Response' a holding response in the hope that the person who asked the question will go away?

Surely 20 days is an adequate amount of time to respond to a Freedom of Information Act request adequately - if there is any will to do so.

Stockport CAMHS Team have advised us that it has NO funding for any autistic child's treatment.

Perhaps that is the reason for Claire Naven's shuffling about. She must surely be fully aware that this situation is of absolutely NO benefit to any autistic child or that child's family?

Perhaps the next series of questions need to focus on what Stockport MBC, which cannot educate autistic children unless they have received the essential speech and language communication help which is usually written into their SEN Statements - but which QUOTE: "is not a Legal requirement".

Apparently speech and language communication help is not thought to be 'educational'?
Which idiot made so blatently wrong a decision?
And on what basis was it made?

A child with autism, who (given - early - the necessary communication help)can express needs, happinesses and respond adequately to teaching staff, will be far less frustrated than a child who is let down by the deliberately covering-up system, which certainly exists in Stockport.

Most parents,if trained by effective professionals, to help an autistic child, will readily continue that help at home, since it is in the interests of the child, the rest of that child's family and their joint social life, to do so. But there is no professional expert help for parents, why not?

Desperate parents go to countries or to London, to undertake courses such as those run by the American SonRise group, on very good courses, often funded by the Caudwell Trust. Why? Because they are desperate to gain help for their child. I might state that the help received is very supportive and practical. So why isn't Stockport MBC offering such help to parents and carers?

The Disability Partnership, in Stockport actively works against individual autistic children, and it does so in 'partnership'.

One strong partner is Stockport NHS Foundation Trust, which runs Stepping Hill Hospital and is closely allied to Pennine Care NHS Foundation Trust, which - in Stockport - does not have the funding to treat children with autism.

The very paediatricians at Stepping Hill Hospital who - being in a prime position to help - refuse to gain such help for autistic children are very ready to drug them instead. I have both the experience and a range of documents which clearly show those facts.

Where the covert initial drugging and proposal to both continue with the first drug and add a far more risky second drug, is resisted by a caring parent, the Hospital Trust whops the matter into the secretive Family Court. I also have arange of documents which show that procedure.

When approached, the Chief Executive, Senior Paediatrician and Medical Director of Stockport NHS Foundation Trust, state that they are happy with the current situation and have no plans to change it. Their names are (non-medical)Dr Chris Burke, Dr Patrick Miller, Dr James Catania. (Their names are shown for your consideration.)

Working together with Stockport MBC, Stockport Hospital Trust, refuses all help to autistic children, threatening and blustering when - a long way down the road (Years of a child's life) the parent realises what is actually happening. At that point they join forces and attempt to quosh all 'rebellion' by already hard-pressed parents.

Where adequate speech and language communication therapy is effectively given by expert professionals,as well as becoming more educable, such children, having had the frustrations of lack of communication removed, also show a clear preference to improve their own behavioural problems, becoming far more sunny-natured in the process. This lifts an enormous burden from both child and parents.

The 'Stockport System', deliberately letting down numerous individual children and their parents, whilst making the pretence of 'complying with the law' is an utter disgrace.

Councillors have been made aware of this over a long period. As the people with the overall remit to employ Council Officers, for the electorate of Stockport, they are 'in dereliction of duty'.

It is time that accountability was brought to the fore, and those taking money to fulfil the remit of their job descriptions at Stockport MBC, need to accept that accountability - and remove themselves from office. (The other alternative being, to throw them out of office, referenceless)

Currently, as I believe, they make a mess, and then move on to higher and better paid jobs elsewhere, with a fine reference, so that they can be got rid of.

Claire Naven is just a front woman for that disgraceful malefaction. She works within Stockport MBC and must - herself - be fully aware of the way it functions. She is also an accountable person, being paid by the electorate of Stockport.

It would be interesting to find out how much the fending off of complaints and the misapplication of the Freedom of Information Act and Data Protection Act, is costing the people of Stockport annually.

The cost to our autistic children is beyond bearing.

So, from that response, hell might very well have frozen over before a sensible response comes in.

I wonder, if the requester were to pop into Ms Naven's Office, would the response be available to be handed over the counter?

That was the way things used to happen.
But I suppose that Like so many people, R Holt has also been awarded a 'barred from all Stockport MBC Property' Notice?

They are very 'popular' - with Stockport MBC, if with no-one else.

No, not barred from council property, as far as I know! I certainly don't blame Ms Naven, as I doubt she is being personally obstructive. I do share many of your frustrations, Charlotte, but I don't think it's Ms Naven's fault - any of it.

Oh My goodness, how true this lot rings with me and we are only just starting our struggle with Stockport.
Our fourth child is being assessed as he "has autistic traits x2 but is not autistic!" - as they say or are they trying to save money already. An experienced health visitor, I have been asking for over a year and expressing concerns about our son. Eventually i insisted on referrals, we got no appointments and i had to complain and quote government targets to eventually get seen, i complained and was told Dr Chris Burke will not elaborate on anything as he does not know why we did not get the appointments we should have, he admits they failed and lost my sons referral with sensitive personal details on but refuses to continue to investigate! I have had no support, trying to help our son, we are paying for private speech therapy because of the unacceptable wait, in the meantime, no one has given me details of local groups or useful websites - i truly could do with people in similar circumstances to be in contact with - it is a nightmare.....

There is an ASD support group for parents on the (usually) 3rd Thursday of each month, at 7pm in Zuris, Hazel Grove. It is excellent.

My son has been 'in the system' for nearly 7 years. I have no complaints about CAMHS, who have been an extremely supportive and helpful service. The main problem we have had has been with the SEN service - years of delays in assessment and provision, only sorted when a threat of Tribunal looms.

Made a complaint a couple of years ago - promises of apologies were made but then no promise was followed through with, hiding behind a Local Government Ombudsman decision that ignored anything longer than a year before the complaint. SMBC decided that it gave them license to also ignore those complaints and withdrew the promises of apologies etc.

I will never forgive SMBC for the delays to my son's provision and for the stress that I have been through to get the provision to which my son was legally entitled BUT I don't think that all services or even all individuals are bad. I think there's a problem with some services (and some are worse than others) and funding problems aren't helping, but there are some excellent individuals and services who genuinely want to do the best that they can.

I also hold onto the fact that I will be suing them when my son turns 16/18 - rather, HE will be suing them, for educational negligence. All incompetence now goes into a file for later and I will feel better about it all then, especially if it changes things for children following on in the future.

The problem is that nobody wins with how things are now. Budget savings now cost more in the future, as the child needs more later on. Short-sightedness, but also very damaging for parents and children in the present. It's all very sad.

BUT, like I said, there are some good people out there. The key is knowing the law so that you can argue from a position of strength and knowledge.

I am continuing to find the whole process very draining I enquired as to when we will receive a formal diagnosis and was told they only do two ADOS assessments per month (give me strength...), they suggest by September I may have a diagnosis, i suspect only because I have made lots of noise, put in a formal complaint and I am aware of government targets and provisions supposed to be available. We have in the past week started PACT with the SALT at the CDU I forced them to get him seen by an OT as he has a paediatrician review this week and my argument was what on earth was he supposed to be reviewing if he had not been seen by anyone! I can hand on heart say that since his first visit with the paediatrician who said he needed to be seen by all disciplines, if it was not for me, we would have attended the review this week having been seen by not one single person, it is an absolute disgrace. On the plus side, i found a charity called the Autumn Group based in Monsall, they have put be on a challenging behaviour workshop this week which is aimed specifically at kids like my son who have expressive language delay. I watched that louis theroux documentary on Thursday and felt a great sense of dread if what the majority were dealing with there is what the future holds, I hope against hope that with our unfailing support, our son can have a happy, successful and fulfilling life.

Oh, absolutely. The future terrifies me and, inevitably, it is up to parents for fight and chase for stuff. I feel more hopeful about my son than I used to, because he has made some improvements in some areas. I used to be convinced that he'd end up in residential care; now, I have other worries, but not that.

The children who I fear more for are those whose parents are unable or unwilling to take on those battles.

Like anything, autism/ language problems respond better to early intervention, but it is so rare to get this without pushing hard.

Hopefully, one day, there will be a government that really cares about these children and councillors and council employees that both care and have the funding to put the right things in place. Until then, we do what we have to do, I guess.

Nobody will ever love our children like we do and I always try to remember that, but it's hard when they're not seen by beurocracy as people, or of value, or as deserving of the extra help that they need.

Good luck with it all.

Thanks, Interestingly i saw an advertisement yesterday on BBC one for Research Autism, Carrie Grant was on it, two of her four kids are autistic. Anyway it spurred me to go on the research autism website and I found some interesting research carried out in the southwest. Early intensive intervention for pre schoolers - it was 25 hours a week with both specialists and parents, the results were pretty good. I followed the links and found the professor heading it is now based at University of Wales Bangor, I have emailed him to ask if he can recommend anything or if there are any studies we can join. I have been banging on about the fact that one appointment for an hour every other week is simply not enough,we are so motivated to help our son reach his best potential but it seems the system is designed to make it difficult. We saw the OT but we had waited that long to see her that all the info she gave me was useless, I had researched it myself and bought all the recommended stuff, so frustrating!!

ABA (probably the 25 hour intensive early intervention) is one of the most evidence-backed interventions for children with autism, and seems to work more effectively the younger it starts. Some refer to it as Lovaas, or Intensive Interaction - I think they're all similar but slightly different in terms of approach.

However...of course, it's very expensive (partly as it's 1:1 and partly because it needs to continue in long holidays to be fully effective) and so I don't know of any council that voluntarily provide it without a Tribunal case.

To Anyone who can help and advise;
We provide primary school transport for children with ASD,but we are allocated the transport run by S.M.B.C. We have been doing this run for 5 years now and I love my work. However in january 2012, we were forced to accept a 12% reduction in transport costs. This was because S.M.B.C transport wanted to reduce their budget.THIS IS SOMEWHAT UNDERSTANDABLE CONSIDERING THE STATE OF THE ECONOMY.Then, in february 2012 ,the council wanted us to acommodate them once again and reduced our costs yet further.We complied to this on the condition that this meant we would be able us to continue the transport , preventing any disruption to their continuity of care and any distress for the children . In the 5 years I have been with these children I can now understand their speech and can communicate with them daily.
We have now been informed by SMBC ,that in September 2012 ,the transport is being allocated elsewhere in order to save more transport costs. SMBC have told the parents and ourselves that the decision is final and cannot be contested ,and that the needs and welfare of these children come second to this .We have shown our committment to these children by cutting our own costs in these hard times. SMBC should show their committment by addressing the situation ,by complying with the requests of the parents who know what is best for their child. THIS IS UTTERLY DISGRACEFUL!!!!.The childrens parents have complained to stockport solutions,the SEN,ANDREW WEBB,and ANDY SIMPKINS,stating that children with ASD do react well to change at all, let alone strangers, but these complaints have come to no avail. Can anyone advise us where we can take this matter further FOR THE SAKE OF THESE LOVELY VUNERABLE CHILDREN.THANK YOU!

We have been 'ruined' by Camhs for over 5 years now, with 2 children under them. Our eldest was diagnosed at 15 and was offered no support individually or as a family, . They now say she is too old to get the same support my newly diagnosed 12 year old is going to receive because she was diagnosed when she was 15. Where is the justice in that? I now have a 16 year old who cannot bear life much longer and CAMHS say go to A and E! This has been going on for 4 years now. WHERE is the suupport and the justice for my child who was left at home to get worse scared to go to school and to live? My 12 year old was said to have behavioral problems and we were put on parenting courses. It took a new psych 2 sessions to read the file of the past 4 years and we finally got a diagnosis of Autism. Thanks for listening to the parents CAMHS.