Definition of a bedroom.
Paul of the Woods Family made this Freedom of Information request to Knowsley Metropolitan Borough Council This request has been closed to new correspondence. Contact us if you think it should be reopened.
Dear Knowsley Metropolitan Borough Council,
As a local authority responsible for the administration of housing benefit, can you tell me what is the legal definition of a bedroom, and which organisation/department/other, is responsible for determining the number of bedrooms in a property for bedroom tax purposes.
Yours faithfully,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Paul,
Thank you for your email received on 12th February 2013 requesting information about bedroom tax.
At present our systems are down and we are unable to supply a reference number. Once the systems are back up I will contact you with your unique reference number.
In the meantime, your request has been passed to the relevant service and you will receive a response by 13th March 2013, as required by law.
If you need further information please contact:
Holly Kennedy
T: 0151 443 3407
E: [email address]
Kind regards
Linda
Linda Tancred
Business Support Officer
Tel: 0151 443 2976
7th Floor, Municipal Buildings, Archway Road, Huyton, L36 9YU
Please find attached our response to your recent Freedom of Information
Request.
Regards
Pauline Wass
Benefit Manager
Knowsley MBC
Contact: [email address]
Telephone: 0151 443 4115
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Dear Paul,
Further to your Freedom of Information request below. Your unique reference number is F2013.02.1493.
Kindest regards,
Linda
Linda Tancred
Business Support Officer
Tel: 0151 443 2976
7th Floor, Municipal Buildings, Archway Road, Huyton, L36 9YU
Dear Tancred, Linda,
Are you aware of the Housing Act 1985, Section 326 and the 'Space standard'?
"No account shall be taken for the purposes of a room having a floor area of less than 50 square feet" with regard to sleeping accomodation. Rooms of 70sq ft or less are large enough for only "half a person".
This is a legal definition, is it not?
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Tancred, Linda,
If according to your Policy, that it is up to the landlord to define the property and yet
20."There is no obligation on landlords to reply to a request for information."
And yet, although you are not prepared to make decisions about property sizes, a tenant can be forced to decide, that's pretty unfair.
"In some circumstances it may be necessary to contact a claimant directly for information about the number of bedrooms in their property. And for new claims from 1 April 2013 we would normally expect claimants to provide the information about property size on their claim form.
21.
If a claimant does not reply to a request for information the local authority has the power to suspend their housing benefit under normal decision making rules."
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Tancred, Linda,
Are you not providing a response to this?
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Mr Woods,
Please see the attached response which was sent to you on 18 February 2013.
Kindest regards,
Freedom of Information
Knowsley MBC
Archway Road
Huyton
Knowsley
Merseyside
L36 9UX
Dear Freedom of Information,
Yes, I did indeed see that response, and I responded to that. Did you not see my responses to your response?
This is the reason why I have responded again, because you have not responded.
To recap, I asked -
"As a local authority responsible for the administration of housing benefit, can you tell me what is the legal definition of a bedroom, and which organisation/department/other, is responsible for determining the number of bedrooms in a property for bedroom tax purposes."
You responded (on 18th Feb 2013) by quoting DWP - (who in a childish and immature manner if you don't mind me saying, said) -
"We will not be defining what we mean by a bedroom in legislation and there is no definition of a minimum bedroom size set out in regulations. It will be up to the landlord to accurately describe the property in line with the actual rent charged."
I responded by pointing out how nonsenical yours and the DWP's response was, BUT you have not responded to this.
"Are you aware that there IS a valid legal definition in the Housing Act 1985, Section 326 and the 'Space
standard'?
"No account shall be taken for the purposes of a room having a floor area of less than 50 square feet" with regard to sleeping accommodation. Rooms of 70sq ft or less are large enough for only "half a person"."
AND
"If according to your Policy, that it is up to the landlord to define the property and yet:
20."There is no obligation on landlords to reply to a request for information."
And yet, although you are not prepared to make decisions about property sizes, a tenant can be forced to decide, that's pretty unfair, wouldn't you say??
"In some circumstances it may be necessary to contact a claimant directly for information about the number of bedrooms in their property. And for new claims from 1 April 2013 we would normally expect claimants to provide the information about property size on their claim form.
21.
If a claimant does not reply to a request for information the local authority has the power to suspend their housing benefit under normal decision making rules."
How oppressive is this?
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Mr Woods,
Freedom of Information request F2013-02-1493
We have looked into your request for information about definition of a bedroom and our response is shown below.
Thank you for your email of 11 December 2013. I would refer you to our previous response to your request dated 20 February 2013 (Reference F2013.02.1493) which provided responses to your questions at the time.
Kind regards,
Freedom of Information
Knowsley MBC
Archway Road
Huyton
Knowsley
Merseyside
L36 9UX
Dear Freedom of Information,
You provide responses, but you did not provide the answers.
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Mr Woods
Thank you for taking the time to contact us.
We will give you a full response within 10 working days. If this is not possible, we will write to you within this time to explain why and let you know how long a full response will take.
If you need any further information please see contact details above.
For your information I have attached the link to the complaint procedure, if you do not have access please contact the customer liaison team for a paper copy.
http://www.knowsley.gov.uk/get-in-touch/...
KMBC Complaints
Customer Liaison Team
6th Floor Huyton Municipal Building
Archway Road
Huyton
L36 9YU
Dear Mr Woods,
I refer to your email dated 13 January 2014 which you sent in response to our response to your FOI request reference F2013-02-1493. I gather from your brief comments that you are dissatisfied with the response provided.
I have reviewed the response provided to you and can confirm that it does provide the information that you have requested.
If you are still not satisfied, I am required to inform you that you can appeal against the decision by contacting the Information Commissioner. The Commissioner’s postal address is Wycliffe House, Water Lane, Wilmslow SK9 5AF. The telephone number for the Information Commissioner’s Office is 0303 123 1113 or 01625 545745. The e-mail address is: [email address]
Yours sincerely
KMBC Complaints
Customer Liaison Team
6th Floor Huyton Municipal Building
Archway Road
Huyton
L36 9YU
Dear KMBC Have your say,
Okay, if that is your view please confirm the 'answer' given by Knowsley Council to the question:
What is the legal definition of a bedroom?
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Mr Woods,
Please find attached the original response which was sent to your Freedom of Information request in response to your question below.
Kindest regards,
Freedom of Information
Knowsley MBC
Archway Road
Huyton
Knowsley
Merseyside
L36 9UX
Dear Freedom of Information,
So, your response and your 'answer' to 'What is the legal definition of a bedroom' is......
"We will not be defining what we mean by a bedroom in legislation"
I'd say that counts as a refusal wouldn't you.
Yours sincerely,
Paul of the Woods Family
Dear Mr Woods,
Freedom of Information request – F2014.03.144
I have looked into your request for information about the definition of a bedroom and have assumed you request is in relation to the administration of Housing Benefit and in particular the Bedroom Tax.
Okay, if that is your view please confirm the 'answer' given by Knowsley Council to the question:
What is the legal definition of a bedroom?
I have provided a copy of my previous response below:
I have looked into your request for information, and our response is shown below:
As a local authority responsible for the administration of housing
benefit, can you tell me what is the legal definition of a bedroom,
and which organisation/department/other, is responsible for
determining the number of bedrooms in a property for bedroom tax
purposes.
The Department for Work and Pensions have provided guidance in circular A4/2012 a copy of which can be found at
http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/a4-2012.pdf
Paragraph 12 applies and states:
“We will not be defining what we mean by a bedroom in legislation and there is no definition of a minimum bedroom size set out in regulations. It will be up to the landlord to accurately describe the property in line with the actual rent charged.”
As you are aware the DWP has not defined a Bedroom in relation to this legislation and that issue is the subject of a number of appeals both at First Tier and Upper Tier.
If you need further information in relation to Benefits Legislation please contact the Department for Work and Pensions.
Kindest regards,
Freedom of Information
Knowsley MBC
Archway Road
Huyton
Knowsley
Merseyside
L36 9UX
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debbie left an annotation ()
I would suggest you ask them if they are aware of LACORS guidance?
Many people are winning FTT Appeals on room size/room use.
There is no definition of a bedroom. therefore, it is open to interpretation??