Complaints against English & Welsh citizens advice bureaux

Oysterman (Account suspended) made this Freedom of Information request to Charity Commission for England and Wales

This request has been closed to new correspondence. Contact us if you think it should be reopened.

The request was partially successful.

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Charity Commission for England and Wales,

Please may the commission by provision of the Freedom of information Act 2000 supply to me:

A) A total count of all complaints against any citizens
advice bureau within England or Wales sent to the commission.

B) All details on these complaints, subsequent action taken and
findings (if any) that the public are permitted to known by law.

Thank you.

Oysterman

Enquiries, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Your e-mail will now be assessed. If we feel that the issues do not fall
within our regulatory remit you may not receive a response from us.
However, if the issues raised fall within our regulatory remit we will aim
to respond to you within fifteen working days from receipt. Please do not
send us a paper version unless we have specifically requested this.

Very often the fastest way to answer your enquiries will be to look at the
frequent questions and guidance on our website
[1]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. You can also view the Welsh version of
our website by clicking on 'Cymraeg' in the top right-hand corner of our
home page.

Are you following us on Twitter? Get short, timely messages from Charity
Commission. Twitter is a rich source of instantly updated information.
It's easy to stay updated on an incredibly wide  variety of topics. Go to
<[2]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> and sign up.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really
need to.

Fe geith eich e-bost eu hasesu. Os rydym yn teimlo bod y materion ddim yn
disgyn o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli efallai ni chewch ateb gennym. Er
hynny, os yw’r mater o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli rydym yn anelu at roi
ateb i chwi o fewn pymtheg diwrnod gwaith o’i dderbyn. Peidiwch ag anfon
fersiwn bapur oni bai ein bod yn gofyn amdano os gwelwch yn dda.

Yn aml y ffordd gyflymach i ateb eich cwestiynau yw drwy edrych ar ein
gwefan [3]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. Gallwch hefyd weld fersiwn Gymraeg
o'n gwefan gan glicio 'Cymraeg' sydd wedi ei leoli i'r dde ar frig y
dudalen cartref.

A ydych yn ein dilyn ar Twitter? Cewch negeseuon amserol a byr gan y
Comisiwn Elusennau. Mae Twitter yn ffynhonnell o wybodaeth sy'n diweddaru
ar unwaith. Mae'n hawdd i gadw eich hun yn ddiweddar gyda amrywiaeth eang
o bynciau. Ewch i <[4]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> i gofrestru.

Ystyriwch yr amgylchedd. Peidiwch â printio'r e-bost yma oni bai fod gwir
ei hangen os gwelwch yn dda.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.

If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete
the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
2. http://twitter.com/chtycommission
3. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
4. http://twitter.com/chtycommission

Becky Bbear left an annotation ()

Oysterman - The Commission doesn't maintain collated records of complaints against specific charities, so to respond to this request it would have to review the entire correspondence history of each such charity individually.

This is likely, given the number of CRB's in England and Wales, to exceed the cost/time limit established under the Freedom of Information Act.

It may be an idea therefore to break the request down into individual years - perhaps one year at a time, making a series of separate requests spaced over time.

You should also be aware that the Commission wouldn't necessarily know the ultimate outcome of those complaints unless they had been told by the complainants or charities concerned - the Commission doesn't deal with complaints involving 'quality of service' issues involving charities, those are internal or Civil matters outside its role as Regulator.

Hope this helps a little while your waiting for them to respond.

Becky

Oysterman (Account suspended) left an annotation ()

I agree the request is best to be re-sent asking for one specific year. I note that there Scottish counterparts seem to keep records of complaints and were (all be it after a fight) able to deliver the complaints to the public. Yet I note that this is England and the law/management might be different. I will withdraw the request and re issue it in due course.

Thanks again.

Business Assurance Casework, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Dear Oysterman

Thank you for your email below.

I must inform you that the Commission is unable to comply with your
request.  Section 12 of the Freedom of Information Act relieves public
authorities of the duty to comply with a request for information if the
cost of dealing with it would exceed the appropriate limit.  The
appropriate limit has been specified in regulations and for central
Government this is set at £600.  This represents the estimated cost of one
person spending 3½ working days in determining whether the Department
holds the information, and locating, retrieving and extracting it. 

The reason that your request exceeds the cost limit is that there are
currently 419 charities registered with the Commission with the words
“citizens advice bureau” or “citizens advice bureaux” in their names. So,
relevant information could be contained in very many files over a long
time period.  Searching all those that might contain relevant information
to determine what information the Commission holds relevant to your
request will exceed the appropriate limit laid down in the regulations. 

If you wish, you may refine your request in order to bring the cost of
determining what relevant information the Commission holds, locating,
retrieving and extracting it, below the appropriate limit.  As the period
covered by your request is very long, one way to refine it would be to
narrow the period it covers. However even a shorter period would require
us to search many files and is unlikely to be sufficient, on its own, to
make it possible for us to comply with your request within the appropriate
limit.  I must also inform you that if the Commission does hold any
information in scope of a refined request, it may be subject to one or
more of the exemptions of the Freedom of Information Act.

If you are dissatisfied with the handling of your request, you have the
right to request a review of our decision.  Any such request should be
submitted within three months of receipt of this email and should be
addressed to:  First Contact, PO Box 1227, Liverpool, L69 3UG
([1][email address]).

Yours sincerely

 

Stephen Grenfell

show quoted sections

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Charity Commission for England and Wales,

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.

I am writing to request an internal review of Charity Commission for England and Wales's handling of my FOI request 'Complaints against English & Welsh citizens advice.

I ask that the commission review the decision on account that there Scottish counterpart "OSCR" have executed the same task with ease.

Note that I only seek a statistical count of complaints to the commission about CABs. I do not need to know what CABs at the moment or what the details are just a statistical count.

To keep cost down at this moment I ask only for a statistical count for CABs in England.

Thank you.

A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address:
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/co...

Yours faithfully,

Oysterman

Enquiries, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Your e-mail will now be assessed. If we feel that the issues do not fall
within our regulatory remit you may not receive a response from us.
However, if the issues raised fall within our regulatory remit we will aim
to respond to you within fifteen working days from receipt. Please do not
send us a paper version unless we have specifically requested this.

Very often the fastest way to answer your enquiries will be to look at the
frequent questions and guidance on our website
[1]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. You can also view the Welsh version of
our website by clicking on 'Cymraeg' in the top right-hand corner of our
home page.

Are you following us on Twitter? Get short, timely messages from Charity
Commission. Twitter is a rich source of instantly updated information.
It's easy to stay updated on an incredibly wide  variety of topics. Go to
<[2]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> and sign up.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really
need to.

Fe geith eich e-bost eu hasesu. Os rydym yn teimlo bod y materion ddim yn
disgyn o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli efallai ni chewch ateb gennym. Er
hynny, os yw’r mater o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli rydym yn anelu at roi
ateb i chwi o fewn pymtheg diwrnod gwaith o’i dderbyn. Peidiwch ag anfon
fersiwn bapur oni bai ein bod yn gofyn amdano os gwelwch yn dda.

Yn aml y ffordd gyflymach i ateb eich cwestiynau yw drwy edrych ar ein
gwefan [3]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. Gallwch hefyd weld fersiwn Gymraeg
o'n gwefan gan glicio 'Cymraeg' sydd wedi ei leoli i'r dde ar frig y
dudalen cartref.

A ydych yn ein dilyn ar Twitter? Cewch negeseuon amserol a byr gan y
Comisiwn Elusennau. Mae Twitter yn ffynhonnell o wybodaeth sy'n diweddaru
ar unwaith. Mae'n hawdd i gadw eich hun yn ddiweddar gyda amrywiaeth eang
o bynciau. Ewch i <[4]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> i gofrestru.

Ystyriwch yr amgylchedd. Peidiwch â printio'r e-bost yma oni bai fod gwir
ei hangen os gwelwch yn dda.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.

If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete
the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
2. http://twitter.com/chtycommission
3. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
4. http://twitter.com/chtycommission

Becky Bbear left an annotation ()

Oysterman - One reason OSCR was able to provide the equivalent information is that it has existed for a much shorter time (only since 2007) than the Commission for England and Wales (since 1853), therefore it has by default received less complaints relating to the charities it now regulates.

A secondary factor is that like all government Departments/Agencies the Commission originally stored information on physical files, physical 'case' files would therefore be routinely destroyed after five years of their closure in line with the document retention policy followed by all such departments/agencies.

This means that the Commission would now only hold those files created after the switch from physical to electronic file storeage, or those older pysical files which were considered important enough to scan and retain.

Logistically, searching 400 plus electronic case files would require someone to open each on screen, read their contents to identify if each related to a complaint, if so extract or print off the relevant correspondence/information and repeat for the next file for that particular charity. Each charity would need to be viewed separately and the same process repeated 400 plus times, before collating all the extracted information to reach a total figure.

It's not impossible, but it would certainly exceed the cost/time limits set by the Freedom of Information Act.

Depending on how each relevant file is titled, it may be possible to run a search for any titled 'complaint' and filter against only those charities with 'CAB' or other keywords appearing in their name.

The problem remains that this may not give a true figure and would still require each to be individually viewed to extract relevant information, or confirm that it was actually a complaint 'against' each charity rather than some other form of complaint involving it - or even one made by it against someone else.

Whichever way the search was made, short of taking it one charity at a time as 400 plus seperate requests each covering a one or two year period from whenever each charity's records began, I can't see any way to get around the cost/time limit.

The end result would still be unlikely to give a 'true' statistical picture for the figures, because some 'complaint' titled files may turn out when viewed not to actually be complaints at all - while some actual complaints may not have been filed under that title.

For what it's worth, my suggestion would be to pick one or two charities (maybe ones in large urban areas) and try for a random sample covering a recent period such as 2011. The results received should give some indication of where to go from there.

I'm guessing that if you try for the full history you could be in for the long-haul on this one, allowing for anything up to 20 days wait per request it could take over 8,000 days to receive all of the responses - which kind of risks triggering the 'vexatious' or 'similar' request exemptions under the FOIA.

By comparison, OSCR had it quite easy since it wouldn't have had anything like those numbers of files/documents to search through.

Probably a silly question, but have you tried asking the CAB National Body if they gather annual statistics covering complaints against themselves or their member branches? If not, may save a lot of time/effort to give it a try.

Becky

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Enquiries,

I withdraw my request on grounds it is too broad.

Yours sincerely,

Oysterman

Enquiries, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Your e-mail will now be assessed. If we feel that the issues do not fall
within our regulatory remit you may not receive a response from us.
However, if the issues raised fall within our regulatory remit we will aim
to respond to you within fifteen working days from receipt. Please do not
send us a paper version unless we have specifically requested this.

Very often the fastest way to answer your enquiries will be to look at the
frequent questions and guidance on our website
[1]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. You can also view the Welsh version of
our website by clicking on 'Cymraeg' in the top right-hand corner of our
home page.

Are you following us on Twitter? Get short, timely messages from Charity
Commission. Twitter is a rich source of instantly updated information.
It's easy to stay updated on an incredibly wide  variety of topics. Go to
<[2]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> and sign up.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really
need to.

Fe geith eich e-bost eu hasesu. Os rydym yn teimlo bod y materion ddim yn
disgyn o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli efallai ni chewch ateb gennym. Er
hynny, os yw’r mater o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli rydym yn anelu at roi
ateb i chwi o fewn pymtheg diwrnod gwaith o’i dderbyn. Peidiwch ag anfon
fersiwn bapur oni bai ein bod yn gofyn amdano os gwelwch yn dda.

Yn aml y ffordd gyflymach i ateb eich cwestiynau yw drwy edrych ar ein
gwefan [3]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. Gallwch hefyd weld fersiwn Gymraeg
o'n gwefan gan glicio 'Cymraeg' sydd wedi ei leoli i'r dde ar frig y
dudalen cartref.

A ydych yn ein dilyn ar Twitter? Cewch negeseuon amserol a byr gan y
Comisiwn Elusennau. Mae Twitter yn ffynhonnell o wybodaeth sy'n diweddaru
ar unwaith. Mae'n hawdd i gadw eich hun yn ddiweddar gyda amrywiaeth eang
o bynciau. Ewch i <[4]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> i gofrestru.

Ystyriwch yr amgylchedd. Peidiwch â printio'r e-bost yma oni bai fod gwir
ei hangen os gwelwch yn dda.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.

If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete
the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
2. http://twitter.com/chtycommission
3. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
4. http://twitter.com/chtycommission

Oysterman (Account suspended)

FOI withdrawen.

Enquiries, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Your e-mail will now be assessed. If we feel that the issues do not fall
within our regulatory remit you may not receive a response from us.
However, if the issues raised fall within our regulatory remit we will aim
to respond to you within fifteen working days from receipt. Please do not
send us a paper version unless we have specifically requested this.

Very often the fastest way to answer your enquiries will be to look at the
frequent questions and guidance on our website
[1]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. You can also view the Welsh version of
our website by clicking on 'Cymraeg' in the top right-hand corner of our
home page.

Are you following us on Twitter? Get short, timely messages from Charity
Commission. Twitter is a rich source of instantly updated information.
It's easy to stay updated on an incredibly wide  variety of topics. Go to
<[2]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> and sign up.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really
need to.

Fe geith eich e-bost eu hasesu. Os rydym yn teimlo bod y materion ddim yn
disgyn o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli efallai ni chewch ateb gennym. Er
hynny, os yw’r mater o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli rydym yn anelu at roi
ateb i chwi o fewn pymtheg diwrnod gwaith o’i dderbyn. Peidiwch ag anfon
fersiwn bapur oni bai ein bod yn gofyn amdano os gwelwch yn dda.

Yn aml y ffordd gyflymach i ateb eich cwestiynau yw drwy edrych ar ein
gwefan [3]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. Gallwch hefyd weld fersiwn Gymraeg
o'n gwefan gan glicio 'Cymraeg' sydd wedi ei leoli i'r dde ar frig y
dudalen cartref.

A ydych yn ein dilyn ar Twitter? Cewch negeseuon amserol a byr gan y
Comisiwn Elusennau. Mae Twitter yn ffynhonnell o wybodaeth sy'n diweddaru
ar unwaith. Mae'n hawdd i gadw eich hun yn ddiweddar gyda amrywiaeth eang
o bynciau. Ewch i <[4]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> i gofrestru.

Ystyriwch yr amgylchedd. Peidiwch â printio'r e-bost yma oni bai fod gwir
ei hangen os gwelwch yn dda.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.

If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete
the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
2. http://twitter.com/chtycommission
3. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
4. http://twitter.com/chtycommission

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Enquiries,

I hear by request the following information under HM Freedom of Information Act 2000.

A) A random sample of two complaints/concerns raised against an English CAB and a Welsh CAB with relevant details as to the nature of the complaints plus the subsequent outcome. I ask that the samples are not information that has been disclosed to myself by the office previously.
,

Oysterman

Enquiries, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Your e-mail will now be assessed. If we feel that the issues do not fall
within our regulatory remit you may not receive a response from us.
However, if the issues raised fall within our regulatory remit we will aim
to respond to you within fifteen working days from receipt. Please do not
send us a paper version unless we have specifically requested this.

Very often the fastest way to answer your enquiries will be to look at the
frequent questions and guidance on our website
[1]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. You can also view the Welsh version of
our website by clicking on 'Cymraeg' in the top right-hand corner of our
home page.

Are you following us on Twitter? Get short, timely messages from Charity
Commission. Twitter is a rich source of instantly updated information.
It's easy to stay updated on an incredibly wide  variety of topics. Go to
<[2]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> and sign up.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really
need to.

Fe geith eich e-bost eu hasesu. Os rydym yn teimlo bod y materion ddim yn
disgyn o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli efallai ni chewch ateb gennym. Er
hynny, os yw’r mater o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli rydym yn anelu at roi
ateb i chwi o fewn pymtheg diwrnod gwaith o’i dderbyn. Peidiwch ag anfon
fersiwn bapur oni bai ein bod yn gofyn amdano os gwelwch yn dda.

Yn aml y ffordd gyflymach i ateb eich cwestiynau yw drwy edrych ar ein
gwefan [3]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. Gallwch hefyd weld fersiwn Gymraeg
o'n gwefan gan glicio 'Cymraeg' sydd wedi ei leoli i'r dde ar frig y
dudalen cartref.

A ydych yn ein dilyn ar Twitter? Cewch negeseuon amserol a byr gan y
Comisiwn Elusennau. Mae Twitter yn ffynhonnell o wybodaeth sy'n diweddaru
ar unwaith. Mae'n hawdd i gadw eich hun yn ddiweddar gyda amrywiaeth eang
o bynciau. Ewch i <[4]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> i gofrestru.

Ystyriwch yr amgylchedd. Peidiwch â printio'r e-bost yma oni bai fod gwir
ei hangen os gwelwch yn dda.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.

If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete
the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
2. http://twitter.com/chtycommission
3. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
4. http://twitter.com/chtycommission

Carroll, Liam, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Dear Oysterman

 

Thank you for your recent email. I see that you have requested the
following information under the Freedom of Information Act (2000).

 

‘A random sample of two complaints/concerns raised against an English CAB
and a Welsh CAB with relevant details as to the nature of the complaints
plus the subsequent outcome. I ask that the samples are not information
that has been disclosed to myself by the office previously’.

 

It appears that you are essentially asking us to perform a functional task
for you. Given our previous correspondence I think it would be useful if
you could provide further clarification on what information it is that you
would like us to provide.

 

You have previously requested a total count of all complaints that we had
received about all Citizens Advice Bureaus (CABs) in England and Wales,
and details of these. As we have said we simply don’t record information
in a way that will enable us to access a list of whatever complaints there
may have been. The only way we could do so would be to review the cases we
have recorded against each CAB individually, before then considering the
specifics of the complaints to see what information could be released. We
have said that this would exceed the limits set down under section 12 of
the Act.

 

I see that we have also answered your request in respect of two specific
CABs. If you would now like us to work through all the CABs we have
recorded I feel that it will be unlikely that we could complete such a
process, as once the cost implications of this are aggregated it will
again fall outside the provisions of the Act. I think, then, that it would
be useful if you could clarify what information you would like to have
received from the Commission at the end of this process.  

 

If you would still like us to consider proceeding with a ‘random’ sample
in the short term then I think that it would be more appropriate for you
to select the CABs in question. Perhaps I could suggest that you consider
those on our Register of Charities, which can be viewed via an advanced
search option available on our website using, perhaps, the words Citizens
Advice Bureaus or CABs.

 

http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/Show...

 

I understand that you will not know which CABs have complaints against
them, so perhaps a list of around 20, selected by you, may be the best
approach. Ultimately, though, it is unlikely that we can do this for all
of the registered CABs which are why it would be useful to know exactly
what information it is that you would like from us.

 

Regards

 

 

Liam Carroll

Complaints and FOI Manager

 

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Carroll, Liam,

I have set the functional task below for the commission to execute as recommended. Please may the commission screen these CABs for complaints/concerns.

Thank you

------------

RANDOMIZED SAMPLE

Ten English CABs were allocated by random selection from the full list of all known English CABs. The 11th was specifically chosen as a CAB from England’s capital London.

1) South Leicestershire (Blaby) Citizens Advice Bureau.

2) Telford & The Wrekin (Madeley) Citizens Advice Bureau

3) Bradford Citizens Advice Bureau

4) Chapeltown Citizens Advice Bureau

5) Barnoldswick Citizens Advice Bureau

6) Birchwood Citizens Advice Bureau

7) Blackpool Citizens Advice Bureau

8) Dorchester & District Citizens Advice
Bureau

9) Lancing & Sompting Citizens Advice
Bureau

10) Stroud & District Citizens Advice
Bureau

11) City of London Citizens Advice Bureau

Ten Welsh CABs were allocated by random selection from the full list of all known Welsh CABs. The 11th was specifically chosen as a CAB from the capital city of Wales .

1) Amlwch Citizens Advice Bureau

2) Llanelli Citizens Advice Bureau

3) Maesteg Citizens Advice Bureau

4) Meirionnydd Advice Centre (Dolgellau)
CAB

5) Newport Citizens Advice Bureau

6) Newtown Advice Centre

7) Pembroke & District Citizens Advice
Bureau

8) Pontypool Citizens Advice Bureau

9) Wrexham Citizens Advice Bureau

10) Ystradgynlais Citizens Advice Bureau

11) Cardiff Citizens Advice Bureau

------------

Carroll, Liam, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Dear Oysterman

 

Thank you for your recent email.  I see that you have requested certain
information and I have taken this to be a request for information under
the provisions of the Freedom of Information Act 2000. I understand that
you would like to know how many complaints the Commission has received
regarding a selection of Citizen Advice Bureaus that you have provided.

 

The Act imposes a duty, set out in section 1 (1) (a) to confirm or deny
whether we hold information of the description specified. In this instance
we do hold information in respect of the request that you have made. As we
have said we simply don’t record information in a way that will enable us
to access a list of whatever complaints there may have been. We can only
review the cases we have recorded against each of the CABs identified, to
see whether there are any complaint cases. Then review any such cases to
see what information there is.  

 

Having considered the information that we have I can confirm that there
are no cases of this nature for the organisations that you have listed.

 

I should say that I could not identify a charitable organisation for
Barnoldswick CAB, Amlwch CAB, Newtown Advice Centre and Pontypool CAB.
Further to this I could only identify a removed charitable organisation
for Lancing and Sompting CAB, Meirionnydd Advice Centre (Dolgellau) CAB
and Ystradgynlais and District Citizens Advice Bureau. For many of the
other organisations I could find both a removed and current registered
organisation and have checked the records we hold for each.

 

I hope that this is sufficient for your needs.

 

Regards

 

Liam Carroll

Complaints and FOI Manager.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Charity Commission for England and Wales,

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.

I am writing to request an internal review of Charity Commission for England and Wales's handling of my FOI request 'Complaints against English & Welsh citizens advice bureaux'.

I am happy that the task has been executed however as part of a reveiw I would only ask that the office highlight the reasons of removal as seems to have been the case for some CAB's.

Thank you.

A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is available on the Internet at this address:
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/co...

Yours faithfully,

Oysterman

Enquiries, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Your e-mail will now be assessed. If we feel that the issues do not fall
within our regulatory remit you may not receive a response from us.
However, if the issues raised fall within our regulatory remit we will aim
to respond to you within fifteen working days from receipt. Please do not
send us a paper version unless we have specifically requested this.

Very often the fastest way to answer your enquiries will be to look at the
frequent questions and guidance on our website
[1]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. You can also view the Welsh version of
our website by clicking on 'Cymraeg' in the top right-hand corner of our
home page.

Are you following us on Twitter? Get short, timely messages from Charity
Commission. Twitter is a rich source of instantly updated information.
It's easy to stay updated on an incredibly wide  variety of topics. Go to
<[2]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> and sign up.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really
need to.

Fe geith eich e-bost eu hasesu. Os rydym yn teimlo bod y materion ddim yn
disgyn o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli efallai ni chewch ateb gennym. Er
hynny, os yw’r mater o fewn ein hawdurdod rheoli rydym yn anelu at roi
ateb i chwi o fewn pymtheg diwrnod gwaith o’i dderbyn. Peidiwch ag anfon
fersiwn bapur oni bai ein bod yn gofyn amdano os gwelwch yn dda.

Yn aml y ffordd gyflymach i ateb eich cwestiynau yw drwy edrych ar ein
gwefan [3]www.charitycommission.gov.uk. Gallwch hefyd weld fersiwn Gymraeg
o'n gwefan gan glicio 'Cymraeg' sydd wedi ei leoli i'r dde ar frig y
dudalen cartref.

A ydych yn ein dilyn ar Twitter? Cewch negeseuon amserol a byr gan y
Comisiwn Elusennau. Mae Twitter yn ffynhonnell o wybodaeth sy'n diweddaru
ar unwaith. Mae'n hawdd i gadw eich hun yn ddiweddar gyda amrywiaeth eang
o bynciau. Ewch i <[4]http://twitter.com/chtycommission> i gofrestru.

Ystyriwch yr amgylchedd. Peidiwch â printio'r e-bost yma oni bai fod gwir
ei hangen os gwelwch yn dda.

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.

If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete
the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
2. http://twitter.com/chtycommission
3. file://www.charitycommission.gov.uk
4. http://twitter.com/chtycommission

Carroll, Liam, Charity Commission for England and Wales

Dear Oysterman

Further to your recent response I have looked again at this matter under
the provisions of the Freedom of Information Act (The Act).  To be clear
that this is not a review of my earlier response rather a reply
to your most recent request for the reasons for the removal of certain
Citizen Advice Bureaus (CAB) from the register of charities. To clarify in
responding to your request for details on complaints received about a
number of various CABs, that you listed, I had mentioned that some had
been removed. Further to this I could identify a number that had details
for both a current and removed registered organisation. You have asked for
detail on the reasons for removal.

I’m not completely sure which charities you are referring too. For the
three I identified:

Ystradgynlais Citizens Advice Bureau (508932)

Merionnydd Citizens Advice Bureau (505235)

These have now been removed from the register. I can find no information
relating to the reasons for this other than the general information on the
website for each organisation which states ‘ceased to exist’.

Lancing and Sompting Citizens Advice Bureau. There were two numbers for
this organisation (205438 and 1096398). There is a letter regarding 205438
received in 2008 stating that the charity had incorporated. For the number
1096398 there is a declaration from the trustees saying that the charity
has merged with another organisation.

On the others where I found both a removed and current number, the current
organisations are charitable companies and it would appear likely then
that the purpose of removal was to enable the organisation to incorporate
and become a charitable company, although some may have amalgamated (such
as Birchwood Citizens Advice Bureau – 511297). You should be able to look
this up for yourself on the Registration search engine on the Commission’s
website and the registration history should indicate a reason for removal.
 

[1]http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/inde...

Regards

Liam Carroll - Complaints and FOI Manager

This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and
delete the original message from your system.

show quoted sections

Communications via the GSi may be automatically logged, monitored and/or
recorded for legal purposes.

References

Visible links
1. http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/inde...

Oysterman (Account suspended)

Dear Carroll, Liam,

I thank the commission for executing the task set.

Oysterman

Becky Bbear left an annotation ()

Oysterman - May be helpful to note that the way charities 'incorporate' is as follows:

(i) The 'original' unincorporated charity decides that it would like to benefit from the additional (but limited) protection afforded by the Limited Liability status enjoyed by Companies.

(ii) It establishes a new Company, with identical or very similar objects and registers this at Companies House.

(iii) Once the new Company exists as a legal entity, the trustees/members of the original charity vote to dissolve and distribute all of the assets/funds of the original charity to the new Charitable Company.

(iv) The new Charitable Company applies to the Commission to be Registered - and is assigned a new Charity Number accordingly.

(v) Once the final distribution of assets/funds has been completed by the original charity it ceases to exist and is removed from the Register of Charities.

The process where two or more charities 'merge' is very similar, one or more dissolve and distribute their assets/funds to the one which will remain.

The remaining charity retains its original charity number and the others are removed having ceased to exist.

Just in case you were uncertain of what Liam was describing in his response.

Becky

Oysterman (Account suspended) left an annotation ()

Thank you Becky :)