ET Cost

V Gray made this Rhyddid Gwybodaeth request to Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

This request has been closed to new correspondence from the public body. Contact us if you think it ought be re-opened.

Roedd y cais yn rhannol lwyddiannus.

Dear Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service,

I would like to know how much the Service has spent outsourcing to either Barristers Chambers or Solicitors at Employment Tribunals for all Service Staff (including Teaching Staff). Any combination of those below, between 1st August 2000 and the 31 October 2010:

1) For constructive dismissal

2) Unfair dismissal

3) One (or more) of the various discrimination claims and/or under the Protection from Harassment Act

4) Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998

5) Any other Employment issues, I may have omitted.

Please name the Solicitors/Barristers that the Council have outsourced to: For example, 2010 Number (which is the cost spent) Name (Name of Solicitor/Barrister). Please provide the figures in the following format e.g. 2006 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITOR OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE; 2007 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITOR OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE; 2008 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITORS OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE ; 2010 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITORS OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE; etc, thus making it easier for one to read and to ensure there is no misunderstandings.

I would request that you include VAT in the figures. Not a before and after VAT, a figure which included total cost including VAT.

Please also send this information as "calendar years" not financial years.

Please note that I do not seek or require any personal information such as names and addresses – only the total figures and name of the law firms whom the Fire Service outsourced too.

I would ask that you remember the statutory duty imposed upon public authorities by virtue of Section 16 of the Freedom of Information Act to provide advice and assistance to requesters. If for any reason you are leaning toward rejecting any part of this request or if you plan to argue that it is unmanageable or unanswerable in any way then I would expect you to contact me promptly to find ways to answer this request to our mutual Satisfaction.

Yours faithfully,

G

Dear Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service,

I must apologise there was slight technical glitch when I first registered which omitted my name. This has now been rectified by the have you say team, who have been extremely helpful in resolving this issue.
I look forward to receiving the correct information from you.

Yours faithfully,

V Gray

Crimmins, Jean, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

1 Atodiad

Dear Ms Gray,

Further to your request for information, please see the attached
correspondence.

Kind regards,

Jean Crimmins

Corporate Information Sharing Officer

0151 296 4474

[1][email address]

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Dear Jean Crimmins

Thank you for your message. I look forward to receiving the correct information.

Yours sincerely,

V Gray

Crimmins, Jean, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

1 Atodiad

Dear Ms Gray,

Further to your request for information, please see the attached
correspondence.

Kind regards,

Jean Crimmins

Corporate Information Sharing Officer

Merseyside Observatory

Knowledge and Information Management

Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service Headquarters

Bridle Road

Bootle

L30 4YD

(T) 0151 296 4474

(F) 0151 296 4631

Mail to: [1][email address]

Intranet/Portal [2]http://intranetportal/sites/KIM/default....

Internet [3]www.merseyfire.gov.uk

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Dear Crimmins, Jean,

You have suggested that I refine the dates within my request but give no indication of the dates for which you might have information available.

Under Section 16 of the Freedom of Information Act, please could you advise me (as per the duty imposed by Section 16) of a possible timeframe which you do have the records for?

Yours sincerely

V Gray

Crimmins, Jean, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

Dear Colleague

I am currently out of the office until Monday 7th March 2011.

If you need any assistance in relation to Data Protection, Freedom of
Information or Information sharing please contact John Curtis (Contact
details below)

If you need any assistance regarding Knowledge and Information Management,
please contact John L Curtis on 0151 296 4566.

Kind regards,
Jean Crimmins
Corporate Information Sharing Officer.
0151 296 4474

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Crimmins, Jean, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

Dear Ms Gray,

Thank you for your e-mail.

Your request is currently being processed and a further response will be
provided to you.

Kind regards,

Jean Crimmins
Corporate Information Sharing Officer
Merseyside Observatory
Knowledge and Information Management
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service Headquarters
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD

(T) 0151 296 4474
(F) 0151 296 4631

Mail to: [email address]


Intranet/Portal http://intranetportal/sites/KIM/default....
Internet www.merseyfire.gov.uk

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Yare, Julie, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

1 Atodiad

Dear Ms Gray

Please see attached letter with regard to your refined request for
information under the Freedom of Information Act 2000.

Best Regards

Julie Yare

Corporate Information Sharing Officer

Merseyside Observatory

Knowledge & Information Management Directorate

Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service HQ

Bridle Rd

Bootle

Liverpool

L30 4YD

(T) 0151 296 4479

(F) 0151 296 4631

Mailto: [1][email address]

[2]http://intranetportal/sites/KIM/default....

Internet: [3]www.merseyfire.gov.uk

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Dear Julie Yare,

Please provide whatever information you can. Given the resources that you have.

Yours sincerely,

V Gray

Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

2 Atodiad

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.

Delivery to the following recipients failed.

[email address]

Dear Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service,

Please provide whatever information you can. Given the resources that you have.

Yours faithfully,

V Gray

Crimmins, Jean, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

1 Atodiad

Dear Ms Gray,

Further to your request for information, please see the attached
correspondence.

Kind regards,

Jean Crimmins

Corporate Information Sharing Officer

Merseyside Observatory

Knowledge and Information Management

Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service Headquarters

Bridle Road

Bootle

L30 4YD

(T) 0151 296 4474

(F) 0151 296 4631

Mail to: [1][email address]

Intranet/Portal [2]http://intranetportal/sites/KIM/default....

Internet [3]www.merseyfire.gov.uk

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Dear Crimmins, Jean,

I would point out that you are a public authority and as such are responsible to the people of Liverpool. I am extremely disappointed at your attempt to hide behind Legislation so that you do not have to provide the correct information.

To state:" In accordance with the Freedom of Information Act 2000 this letter acts as a Refusal Notice.
The exemptions applied are as follows:

Section 41 (Information provided in confidence)

Section 43 (Commercial Interests)

These exemptions apply because the release of any information would constitute a breach of confidence and commercial interests to the Barrister who represented the Authority at Employment Tribunals."

Since when has a Public Authority put Solicitors/Barrister commercial interests before the people of Liverpool?

I would point out, in cases where Tribunal proceedings have been brought, the names of the representatives of both parties and their counsel are published in the Tribunal's decision. There is no expectation of privacy and these cases are not the sort dealt with
by the Family Division of the High Court or the Court of Protection where anonymity is required in order to safeguard vulnerable children or adults.

Please supply the information I have requested. I have also sent a copy of this link to my local MP and Joe Anderson as I feel that a public authority you are failing to adhere to the FOIA.

Yours sincerely,

V Gray

Crimmins, Jean, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

Dear Colleague

I am currently out of the office until Wednesday13th July 2011 (PM).

My normal working days are Wednesday, Thursday and Friday.

If you need any assistance in relation to Data Protection, Freedom of
Information or Information sharing please contact John Curtis (Contact
details below)

If you need any assistance regarding Knowledge and Information Management,
please contact John L Curtis on 0151 296 4566.

Kind regards,
Jean Crimmins
Corporate Information Sharing Officer.
0151 296 4474

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Gadawodd V Gray anodiad ()

Same Copy Sent to MP and leader of Council

Dear Joe

I hope you are well? I requested information from Merseyside Fire and Rescue on the 14 January 2011. Alas, they have refused to respond to this request on the grounds of protecting the interests of Solicitors/Barristers. I feel this is an insult to the tax payers of Liverpool. As they are obliged by legislation to assist with the request, I felt rather than involve the Information Commissioner, it would be more productive to ask you to intervene.

Here is the link for the request. http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/et...

Thank you for your assistance.

Kindest Regards

V Gray

Curtis, John, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

Vicky Gray Sent via Email.

Your Ref: Our Ref:
FOI/05/2011 Date 28^th July 2011

Dear Ms Gray

FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT 2000 - INFORMATION REQUEST

Further to our letter of the 18^th May and your further email of the 12^th
July. I have reconsidered your initial request. You requested the
following information:

Barrister costs for attending Employment Tribunals during the period 2008,
2009 and 2010.

I note that within your email you have stated that you feel we are hiding
behind legislation. I disagree that we are hiding behind legislation, but
are clearly following the Freedom of Information Act.

As you will be aware under the Freedom of Information Act we have a duty
to consider whether or not information should be provided. The information
you requested specifically relates to costs of a Barrister used by the
Fire Authority.

As such we have assessed your request and whether or not that could impact
upon the commercial interests and confidence we have with third parties
who are acting on behalf of the Authority.

In our opinion your request would impact upon the commercial interests and
confidence we have with a third party, and as such I am not obliged to
supply the information you requested.

In addition to this, and on further review or your appeal, some employment
tribunal cases relating to 2010 have not concluded and as such section 42
(legal professional privilege) is also applied.

In accordance with the Freedom of Information Act 2000 this letter acts as
a Refusal
Notice.

The exemptions applied are as follows:

Section 41 (Information provided in confidence)

Section 43 (Commercial Interests)

Section 42 (legal professional privilege)

The reasons for applying these exemptions are explained within this
letter.

I also note that you intend to inform your Local MP and Joe Anderson.

You also have the right of appeal to the Information Commissioner at:

Information Commissioner's Office
Wycliffe House
Water Lane
Wilmslow
Cheshire
SK9 5AF
Telephone: 01625 545 700
[1]http://www.ico.gov.uk/

Yours sincerely

John L Curtis

Director

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Dear Curtis, John,

Thank you for your response. Please explain why you are putting the commercial interests of Barristers and Solicitors, before your legal obligations (Section 16 of the FOIA). Your quoting "Section 41 (Information provided in confidence) Section 43 (Commercial Interests) Section 42 (legal professional privilege)".

You are not complying with your legal obligation, as I have previously stated you are putting the commercial interests of Barristers/Solicitors before Legislation introduced to ensure that public authorities adhered to the Freedom Of Information Act. I have have made a formal complaint to the Information Commissioner concerning this request.

Yours sincerely,

V Gray

Curtis, John, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

SENT VIA EMAIL

                                      

 

 

 

Your Ref:                                Our
Ref: FOI/Gray/2011        Date 14^th October 2011

 

                  

Dear Ms Gray

 

 

FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT 2000 - INFORMATION REQUEST

 

 

You requested the following information:

 

Barrister costs for attending Employment Tribunals during the period 2008,
2009 and 2010.

 

After further consideration of your request, detailed below are the costs
by calendar year.

 

2008 = £0

2009 = £2,000.00

2010 = £3,750.00

 

 

Yours sincerely

 

John L Curtis

 

Head Knowledge and Information Management

Chief Information Officer

Knowledge and Information Management

Strategic Planning Directorate

Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service HQ

Bridle Road

Bootle

Liverpool

L30 4YD

 

[T] 0151 296 4566

[F] 0151 296 4631

[M] 0772 969 0876

Mailto: [1][email address]

 

Intranet/Portal: [2]http://intranetportal/sites/KIM/default....

 

Internet: [3]www.merseyfire.gov.uk

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

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solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message. 

Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender,
except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be
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Dear Mr Curtis

You failed to mention the following: I would like to know how much the Service has spent outsourcing to either Barristers Chambers or Solicitors at Employment Tribunals for all Service Staff (including Teaching Staff). Any combination of those below, between 1st August 2000 and the 31 October 2010:

1) For constructive dismissal

2) Unfair dismissal

3) One (or more) of the various discrimination claims and/or under
the Protection from Harassment Act

4) Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998

5) Any other Employment issues, I may have omitted.

Please name the Solicitors/Barristers that the Council have outsourced to: For example, 2010 Number (which is the cost spent)Name (Name of Solicitor/Barrister). Please provide the figures in the following format e.g. 2006 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITOR OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE; 2007 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITOR OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE; 2008 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITORS OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE ; 2010 – NUMBER HERE AND SOLICITORS OR BARRISTERS NAME HERE; etc, thus making it easier for one to read and to ensure there is no misunderstandings. Had I wanted just figures I would have requested just figures.

Please provide the information I have requested. I would remind you by law you are obliged to provide the correct information, which you are failing to adhere to.

The information I requested was from, between 1st August 2000 and the 31 October 2010 which you have failed to provide. You have failed to name the Barristers/solicitor or what the Employment issues were.

Please provide the information I have requested. I would remind you by law you are obliged to provide the correct information, which you are failing to adhere to.

Yours sincerely

V Gray

Curtis, John, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service

Dear Ms Gray

Further to your email of the 14th October, we confirmed with you on the 10th February that the information you initially requested exceeded the appropriate limit.

You then asked us to advise you of the best possible timeframe for which we have records available. We confirmed to you that our Finance department advised that we could possibly go back over the last three years. On the 21 March 2011 you then stated "Please provide whatever information you can. Given the resources that you have."

The response below therefore details the costs for the last 3 years, all of which relate to Harrington Street Chambers.

Yours sincerely

John L Curtis

dangos adrannau a ddyfynnir

Dear Mr Curtis

Thank you for providing the correct information.

Yours sincerely

V Gray

Gadawodd V Gray anodiad ()

The only reason the infomation was provided was a result of the intervention of the ICO.

Copy of an email from ICO.
_______________________________________________________

Dear Ms Gray

Thank you for your email of 8 October 2011.

I am the case officer responsible for investigating your complaint. I sent the attached introduction email on 20 September 2011 but it appears I sent this to an old email address we have on our records for you. Please accept my apologies for this.

As the attached email explains, I am expecting to receive a response from Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service (‘MFRS’) on or around 18 October 2011.

Once I have received a response from MFRS and decided how your complaint should proceed, I will write to you again with a further update.

I trust this is satisfactory and thank you for your continued patience.

Yours sincerely

Samantha Coward