COST OF BANKRUPTING THE PIER OWNER

Mr Hall made this Freedom of Information request to Conwy County Borough Council

The request was refused by Conwy County Borough Council.

From: Mr Hall

17 July 2009

Dear Sir or Madam,

Could you please provide me with details of how much of my and
other hardworking taxpayers money has been spent to try and
bankrupt the Owner of Colwyn Bays Victoria Pier owner Mr Steve Hunt
over alleged unpaid business rates and why this was a viable
option? Also as to why an offer was not made to the owner to
settle/pay off the debt over a certain period of time as is done
with people who fall behind with standard council tax payments, and
any minutes that cover my questions please.

Yours faithfully,

Mr Hall

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From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

20 July 2009

Dear Mr Hall

Thank you for your request for information. We will now proceed with
considering your request and it is our intention to have responded by
14/8/2009, if not sooner.

Some of the information we hold may be regarded as exempt information,
i.e. it will not or cannot be given to you and you will be advised if
this is the case.

Once the information has been identified the Council may also ask that a
fee
be paid for processing and delivering the information to you. Details of
any
fee to be charged will be notified to you as soon as possible.

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit
Cyngor Bwrdeistef Sirol CONWY County Borough Council
E-Bost / E-Mail: [Conwy Council request email]

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From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

21 July 2009

Dear Mr Hall

Due consideration has been given to your request below and it has been
decided that due to a current unresolved issue which is awaiting
clarification from the Information Commissioners Office your request
cannot be progressed at this time.

Your request will be kept on hold until such time as the clarification
requested from the Information Commissioners Office is received.

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit
Cyngor Bwrdeistef Sirol CONWY County Borough Council
E-Bost / E-Mail: [Conwy Council request email]

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Steve Hunt left an annotation (21 July 2009)

They're desperate to keep this a secret, since it runs to tens of thousands of pounds already...

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Steve Hunt left an annotation (24 August 2009)

The issue has been resolved: the Information Commissioner has ruled that the Council MUST disclose this information. The case reference number at the ICO is RFA0244639

Mr Hall, I would suggest you submit a formal complaint to the Information Commissioner - you are welcome to refer to the above case number.

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From: Mr Hall

25 August 2009

Dear Info Regs Unit,

Having seen an annotation on this request by another user, It seems
that the issue has been resolved, so could I please have my request
answered ASAP please. Just in case you have not seen the
annotation- it refers to case reference number at the Information
Commisioners Office-RFA0244639

Yours sincerely,

Mr Hall

Link to this

From: Mr Hall

26 August 2009

Dear Sir or Madam,

Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of
Information reviews.

I am writing to request an internal review of Conwy Council's
handling of my FOI request 'COST OF BANKRUPTING THE PIER OWNER'.

A full history of my FOI request and all correspondence is
available on the Internet at this address:
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/co...

Yours faithfully,

Mr Hall

Link to this

From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

27 August 2009

Dear Mr Hall

The Information Commissioner has decreed that the information sought in
your request is to be considered as 'personal data' as defined by the
Data protection Act.

Therefore disclosure of this information in response to a Freedom of
Information request could potentially give rise to a breach of the Data
Protection Act.

Due consideration is being given to your request and you will be
contacted again shortly as to the outcome.

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit Cyngor
Bwrdeistef Sirol CONWY County Borough Council E-Bost / E-Mail:
[Conwy Council request email]

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Steve Hunt left an annotation (27 August 2009)

I hereby give my permission for the public disclosure of the information requested by Mr Hall in the above FOI request.

Steve Hunt,
Victoria Pier.

Link to this

From: Mr Hall

28 August 2009

Dear Info Regs Unit,

Please see annotation above.

Yours sincerely,

Mr Hall

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From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

28 August 2009

Dear Mr Hall

This Unit is unable to see any annotation either attached or enclosed as
part of your email below.

Please can you advise exactly what it is you are drawing our attention
to?

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit
Cyngor Bwrdeistef Sirol CONWY County Borough Council
E-Bost / E-Mail: [Conwy Council request email]

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From: Mr Hall

28 August 2009

Dear Info Regs Unit,

Steve Hunt left an annotation (27 August 2009)

I hereby give my permission for the public disclosure of the
information requested by Mr Hall in the above FOI request.

Steve Hunt,
Victoria Pier.

Yours sincerely,

Mr Hall

Link to this

From: Mr Hall

1 September 2009

Dear Sir or Madam,

Could you please confirm receipt of my follow up

Yours faithfully,

Mr Hall

Link to this

From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

3 September 2009

Dear Mr Hall

Thank you for bringing the annotation below to our attention.

It is not possible for this Council to verify that any
comments/annotations/emails etc left or sent via a public website are
indeed from the person or persons they purport to be from.

The Information Commissioner has decreed that the information you
requested is to be considered as 'personal data' relative to the Pier
owner. To this end the requirements of the Data Protection Act in
relation to the Pier owner must be observed in addition to those of the
Freedom of Information Act.

As previously advised on the 27/8/2009 to disclose any information at
this stage, and in particular on the basis of an unverified annotation
on a public website could give rise to a breach of the Data Protection
Act.

Again as previously advised due consideration will be given to your
request and you will be advised in due course of the outcome.

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit Cyngor
Bwrdeistef Sirol CONWY County Borough Council E-Bost / E-Mail:
[Conwy Council request email]

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Steve Hunt left an annotation ( 3 September 2009)

Isn't it amusing that the Council is suddenly interested in NOT breaking the Law, when they have willfully done so so many times in the past couple of years, and continue to do so with regard to any questions I ask?... Indeed the Council are due in Court on the 15th of this month due to their refusal to comply with another Court Order I gained against them in relation to Data Protection!

Mr Hall - ask the Council to send me some kind of code word in the post to the Pier (by recorded delivery, or they'll allege they sent it and I didn't reply and therefore I don't exist!), and I will post that code word here on the website so they can authenticate that this is really me! ... that is the same method that Banks, and indeed the "Government Gateway" uses to give access to much more highly sensitive personal information we are dealing with here - so if it is good enough for HMRC and the Banks, it is good enough for CCBC!

What the Council hate is that (so far) they have not found a way of censoring this website, unlike other sectors of the media. Their only method of keeping the truth from the public via this medium is just to refuse to answer questions, which of course is directly contrary to the intent of this website and indeed the FOI Act in the first place!

The Council's excuses get more and more hilarious by the day!

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From: Mr Hall

7 September 2009

Dear Info Regs Unit,

Please see further annotation which read

Steve Hunt left an annotation (3 September 2009)

Isn't it amusing that the Council is suddenly interested in NOT
breaking the Law, when they have willfully done so so many times in
the past couple of years, and continue to do so with regard to any
questions I ask?... Indeed the Council are due in Court on the 15th
of this month due to their refusal to comply with another Court
Order I gained against them in relation to Data Protection!

Mr Hall - ask the Council to send me some kind of code word in the
post to the Pier (by recorded delivery, or they'll allege they sent
it and I didn't reply and therefore I don't exist!), and I will
post that code word here on the website so they can authenticate
that this is really me! ... that is the same method that Banks, and
indeed the "Government Gateway" uses to give access to much more
highly sensitive personal information we are dealing with here - so
if it is good enough for HMRC and the Banks, it is good enough for
CCBC!

What the Council hate is that (so far) they have not found a way of
censoring this website, unlike other sectors of the media. Their
only method of keeping the truth from the public via this medium is
just to refuse to answer questions, which of course is directly
contrary to the intent of this website and indeed the FOI Act in
the first place!

The Council's excuses get more and more hilarious by the day!

Please advise accordingly

Yours sincerely,

Mr Hall

Link to this

From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

10 September 2009

Dear Mr Hall

You have been advised on two separate occasions (27/8 & 3/9) that due
consideration will be been given to your request.

The ICO has decreed the information requested is 'personal data'
relative to the Pier owner. The issue regarding consent of the Pier
owner to disclose their personal data to you, whilst important, is not
the only consideration.

A further and more important consideration is whether or not the
disclosure of the 'personal data' of the pier owner to you would be
deemed to be fair? Would the Pier owner at the time their 'personal
data' was being processed in relation to the subject matter have
reasonably expected that their 'personal data' would at some later point
be disclosed in response to an FOI request? Is the wider public interest
best served in disclosing the 'personal data' of the Pier owner in
relation to the above subject matter, or is it best served in it being
withheld?

The information in question is being prepared for disclosure to the Pier
directly under the provisions of the DPA, and once a few formalities
(such as identification) have been completed this will undoubtedly occur
and the Pier owner will therefore also be at liberty to place the
information in the public domain should they choose.

If after due considerations the decision of this authority is that the
information requested should be disclosed, then the consent of the Pier
owner may be required and if so this can easily and simply be achieved
by the Pier owner submitting a signed written statement to this
authority providing explicit consent that the information you request
can be disclosed to you via the medium of a publicly accessible website.
It will not be facilitated by the issuing of code words and/or
passwords.

No further communications will be entered into on this subject until
such time as the due considerations have taken place, after which you
will be advised of the outcome. I am unable at this point to advise you
exactly when this will be, but it is anticipated it will be within the
next 10 to 20 working days.

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit Cyngor
Bwrdeistef Sirol CONWY County Borough Council E-Bost / E-Mail:
[Conwy Council request email]

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Steve Hunt left an annotation (11 September 2009)

I have already given my consent for the information requested to be disclosed publicly on this website, I have given proof of my identity, and CCBC also have payment in the form of my money which they illegally hold. I will shortly file a case at the County Court challenging CCBC's stance on this matter, which will of course incur considerable further costs to the Taxpayer.

Link to this

From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

24 September 2009

Unit FOI 803-09

Dear Mr Hall

The Council has now had the opportunity to consider your request.

The ICO has previously decreed that the information you requested is
'personal data' relative to the Pier owner. This required that in
considering your request under the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) the
Council also had to consider its obligations to the Pier owner under the
Data Protection Act (DPA). To do this the Council needed to consider in
particular S40 (2) of the FOIA which is an exemption that invokes
elements of the DPA.

In accordance with Council procedures in cases where a qualified
exemption and/or the public interest are to be considered, the issue
must be put before the Qualified Persons Group (QPG) who will make the
decision.

The 1st data protection principle requires that the following two
elements are present when processing (which includes disclosing)
'personal data'
a) To process fairly and b) To process lawfully.

To satisfy the 'fairness' element requires that at the time the personal
data was gathered/processed the data subject (in this case the Pier
owner) was made aware of 1) who the data controller is, 2) what the data
would be used for, and with whom it might be shared, and 3) anything
else required to ensure fairness.

At the time of the bankruptcy proceedings the Pier owner would have been
aware that the data controller was CCBC, they would also have been aware
that their personal data was being used in conjunction with the recovery
of NNDR and if necessary any subsequent court proceedings.

The QPG decided that disclosing under FOIA, the 'personal data' relative
to the Pier owner in conjunction with their bankruptcy would be deemed
to be unfair and would be a breach of the 1st data protection principle.

The QPG believes that the pier owner at the time the processing took
place would have had a reasonable expectation that their information
(personal data) would only be used for, and shared with those, necessary
for the relevant due process to take place. The Pier owner would not
have reasonably expected their personal data to be disclosed at some
later date in response to an enquiry under the FOIA.

S40 (2) is a 'qualified exemption' which means that any decision to
withhold information is also subject to the public interest test. In
such a case, if it is deemed to be more in the public interest to
disclose the information, then the information should not be withheld.

In considering the public interest elements the QPG further decided that
the public interest is deemed to be best served by CCBC protecting the
personal data of individuals in accordance with the requirements of the
DPA.

Having considered your request in line with S40 (2) of the FOIA and the
public interest, the QPG decision is to withhold the information.

If you are dissatisfied with the handling of your request, you have the
right to ask for an internal review within the next 2 months and/or make
a formal complaint. Details on how to make a complaint is available via
the following link:

http://www.conwy.gov.uk/upload/public/at...
.pdf

If you are not content with the outcome of the internal review and/or
complaint, you have the right to apply directly to the Information
Commissioner for a decision and you should contact The Information
Commissioner's Office (Wales), Cambrian Buildings, Mount Stuart Square,
Cardiff CF10 5FL.

Uned Reoliadau Gwybodaeth/Information Regulations Unit Cyngor Bwrdeistef
Sirol CONWY County Borough Council E-Bost / E-Mail:
[Conwy Council request email]

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Steve Hunt left an annotation (24 September 2009)

What a complete load of TOSH - since when have CCBC suddenly decided to be so concerned about the Law? - and if they are, why are they breaking it by refusing to answer numerous other FOI requests made on this site?

CCBC only like to use Law as an excuse to their own ends - NOT in the public interest as they claim. It is NOT in the public interest to have wasted tens of thousands of pounds of taxpayers money fighting me over a falsified debt of five thousand odd, which they knew I did not owe in the first place!

It is NOT in the public interest to force a Data Protection Case to Court, which they could not win, and then have costs awarded against them... and it was most certainly NOT in the public interest to then refuse to pay those costs, resulting in bailiffs costs being added at additional cost to the taxpayer, and then refuse to pay those too, resulting in yet another trip to court for yet another case they could not possibly win! - That has now cost the local taxpayer several more hundreds of pounds - NOT in the public interest!

Mr Hall, I have given my permission for this data to be disclosed numerous times. I implore you to take this to the ICO - as soon as you get a case number from them please let me know, and I will also write to them enclosing copies of the permission I have given CCBC to disclose the information you are asking for.

The truth is CCBC have dug themselves into such a huge hole over all this, they can't stop... as soon as they stop, the truth will be out and the corruption exposed... all they know how to do is keep digging and digging and hope the awkward questions stop and the problem goes away - and ALL AT TAXPAYERS EXPENSE

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From: Mr Hall

28 September 2009

Dear Info Regs Unit,

This IS a request for recorded information, please rethink your
internal review or I shall lodge another complaint with the ICO

Yours sincerely,

Mr Hall

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Steve Hunt left an annotation (29 September 2009)

In any case, this is NOT private information which could be exempted under the FOI provisions for 3 very simple reasons:

1) the Council is a public body, and how it spends the public's money IS a matter for public scrutiny and concern, and indeed accountability.

2) since the Council took the matter to Court - all court matters are a matter of public record in any case - details of any bankruptcy are public records.

3) the Council have been quoted in the media several times regarding bankrupting me - thus making the whole case and various details of it public.

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From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

14 October 2009

Dear Mr Hunt

Please be advised that the Council will not be 'rethinking' its
decision.

The role and remit of the Qualified Persons Group is to consider/review
an exemption from disclosure under the Freedom of Information Act. The
detailed outcome was made known to you by email on the 24th of September
2009. The decision is final and there is no other internal mechanism to
redress afterwards.

If for whatever reason you are unhappy with our response please contact
the Information Commissioner Wales, Cambrian Buildings, Mount Stewart
Square, Cardiff. CF10 5FL.

Yours sincerely

David Smith
Corporate Information & Complaints Manager

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From: Info Regs Unit
Conwy County Borough Council

14 October 2009

Apologises re last message as it should have been addressed to a Mr Hall
and not Mr Hunt

Yours sincerely

David Smith
Corporate Information & Complaints Manager

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Things to do with this request

Anyone:
Conwy County Borough Council only: